Submission Information:
Series: Super Mario
Game: Super Paper Mario
Console: Nintendo Wii
Title: Sammer's Kingdom
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arrangers: mariolegofan (http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3424) & King Sammer (http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?action=profile;u=4309)
Replacement Information:
Links to Existing Sheet: MUS (http://www.ninsheetm.us/download/mus/599) | MIDI (http://www.ninsheetm.us/download/mid/599) | PDF (http://www.ninsheetm.us/download/pdf/599)
Replacement Type: Challenge (new arranger)
[attachment deleted by admin]
I already had a bad feeling, before even clicking the download.
In b4 close :D
At first glance, it looks like a midi.....
And the formatting is hideous.
I think this is the best one I could make...
I fixed it all up and now I think I'll earn 5 stars.
Quote from: King Sammer on February 04, 2015, 04:46:53 PMI fixed it all up and now I think I'll earn 5 stars.
You did not and you will not.
Quote from: Xaoz on February 04, 2015, 04:59:16 PMYou did not and you will not.
But... But... Look! On the forum, a lot of the users approve of it! simmerskingdom.createaforum.com/submissions/my-own-theme (http://simmerskingdom.createaforum.com/submissions/my-own-theme)
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 01, 2015, 01:27:05 PMAt first glance, it looks like a midi.....
And the formatting is hideous.
I'm curious, was this derived from a MIDI though? Because the number of ledger lines in certain parts is questionable, as well as the placement of some of the dynamics symbols...
Quote from: Latios212 on February 04, 2015, 06:19:47 PMI'm curious, was this derived from a MIDI though? Because the number of ledger lines in certain parts is questionable, as well as the placement of some of the dynamics symbols...
Bingo!
And that is the reason that makes me wonder why this thread is still open...
Quote from: King Sammer on February 04, 2015, 05:54:32 PMBut... But... Look! On the forum, a lot of the users approve of it! simmerskingdom.createaforum.com/submissions/my-own-theme (http://simmerskingdom.createaforum.com/submissions/my-own-theme)
I'm fairly certain that every single member on that forum is just King Sammer on multiple accounts. Stop trying to justify crap. We're here to help you arrange, but just because you made something doesn't mean it's perfect.
And besides, even if they are real, 4 people is not "a lot."
Quote from: Xaoz on February 04, 2015, 06:23:28 PMBingo!
And that is the reason that makes me wonder why this thread is still open...
Oh. My. God. This is not from a Midi. IT'S ORIGINAL!!!
Then please explain why, for example in the last measure:
- The notes in the top staff are written with so many ledger lines when a clef change or 8vb would clearly make it better?
- The fff symbol overlaps the bottom staff?
- There is a lack of a repeat sign when you repeat the entire first half of the sheet note-for-note in the second half of the sheet?
Quote from: Latios212 on February 04, 2015, 06:43:40 PMThen please explain why, for example in the last measure:
- The notes in the top staff are written with so many ledger lines when a clef change or 8vb would clearly make it better?
- The fff symbol overlaps the bottom staff?
- There is a lack of a repeat sign when you repeat the entire first half of the sheet note-for-note in the second half of the sheet?
I lost my old computer that had the program that could do clef changes or 8vb. I only have Finale Notepad 2012 now. I have Merlee's Mansion, which I plan to publish, and I did that with my old computer... Can you do it for me?
Quote from: King Sammer on February 04, 2015, 06:47:45 PMI lost my old computer that had the program that could do clef changes or 8vb. I only have Finale Notepad 2012 now. I have Merlee's Mansion, which I plan to publish, and I did that with my old computer... Can you do it for me?
I wasn't questioning the software that you use; I was just bringing into question why the notes and marks were placed where they were. I use Notepad too, but I don't try to force notes where they don't belong - there are helpful people around to help with formatting. Furthermore, you
can add a repeat sign and move around the dynamics markings in Notepad. There are numerous ways to get help before submitting something (Help board, posting under Personal Arrangement Threads, PMing someone), so the glaring formatting awkwardness really threw me off and still is.
Quote from: Dudeman on February 04, 2015, 06:25:14 PMI'm fairly certain that every single member on that forum is just King Sammer on multiple accounts. Stop trying to justify crap. We're here to help you arrange, but just because you made something doesn't mean it's perfect.
And besides, even if they are real, 4 people is not "a lot."
I'm gonna stop talking now and wait for someone more experienced than me to weigh in on this.
I'm still pretty skeptical.
This should not be here. Not just because it is a mediocre arrangement, but also because the arrangement on the site is perfectly acceptable and better than this one. Where is the intro? Why not just move all the low notes up an octave? Why is the title missing on every page except the first?
Quote from: Maelstrom on February 06, 2015, 10:06:30 AMThis should not be here. Not just because it is a mediocre arrangement, but also because the arrangement on the site is perfectly acceptable and better than this one. Where is the intro? Why not just move all the low notes up an octave? Why is the title missing on every page except the first?
True, but the one on site still needs replaced.
I have a proposition for you King Sammer:
I'll look over your arrangement and fix
EVERYTHING for you which might take a while,
HOWEVER, in return, you put my name on it as a co-arranger.
Otherwise, this submission will get deleted.
Good Idea, King?
Still not sure why this thread is still open... ???
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 06, 2015, 10:10:03 AMTrue, but the one on site still needs replaced.
I have a proposition for you King Sammer:
I'll look over your arrangement and fix EVERYTHING for you which might take a while, HOWEVER, in return, you put my name on it as a co-arranger.
Otherwise, this submission will get deleted.
Good Idea, King?
This.
If King Sammer responds and agrees with what I said, I'll fix his "arrangement."
I feel like this could possibly be a big learning moment for Sammer in the fact that if he's serious about arranging, this will really help him in a life-changing, apocalyptic way. Unless of course, he just hires MLF to do everything for him. I'm not getting myself involved here; just making an observation.
But if you want my opinion, I think it's a midi of some kind. Maybe its an original of his but it's still an imported midi (and not a good midi either).
Quote from: JDMEK5 on February 06, 2015, 11:20:52 AMI feel like this could possibly be a big learning moment for Sammer in the fact that if he's serious about arranging, this will really help him in a life-changing, apocalyptic way. Unless of course, he just hires MLF to do everything for him. I'm not getting myself involved here; just making an observation.
But if you want my opinion, I think it's a midi of some kind. Maybe its an original of his but it's still an imported midi (and not a good midi either).
Well,
this time and
only this time, I'll fix it for him (mainly cause I want a replacement of this on the site.) I will make a list of all the mistakes too of course for the learning experience.
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 06, 2015, 10:57:20 AMThis.
If King Sammer responds and agrees with what I said, I'll fix his "arrangement."
:)
Thank god!
Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeesh....this is a tough song. I hate arranging Super Paper Mario songs :P
Here it is in a .zip (pdf, mus, and midi inside)
Edit the submission and put these in ^
https://www.dropbox.com/s/re7rr5dqc02b6o7/Super%20Paper%20Mario%20-%20Sammer%27s%20Kingdom.zip?dl=0
Ok Guys! Feedback would be great! :)
Bespinben, Deku, Olimar....
Original: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cnbOpRPBK4
Your base clef is wrong and the middle voices are wrong. This is SPM yo, gotta listen a bit closer.
Quote from: FireArrow on February 06, 2015, 10:09:57 PMYour base clef is wrong
what do u mean the bass clef is wrong?
No, I mean your base is wrong. I know you've been trying to get way down there, but I really don't wanna go beyond second.
Just wondering, why doesn't the first part use F minor as its key signature?
Also, in m. 3, the last ornament should be a Db grace note and an F.
The B double flats should be A naturals.
I'm not on my computer right now.....
Quote from: InsigTurtle on February 06, 2015, 11:15:43 PMJust wondering, why doesn't the first part use F minor as its key signature?
Also, in m. 3, the last ornament should be a Db grace note and an F.
Quote from: Deku Trombonist on February 06, 2015, 11:19:28 PMThe B double flats should be A naturals.
I'll get this stuff fixed.
Quote from: FireArrow on February 06, 2015, 10:09:57 PMYour base clef is wrong and the middle voices are wrong. This is SPM yo, gotta listen a bit closer.
Still don't know what you're talking about XD
Quote from: FireArrow on February 06, 2015, 10:09:57 PMthe middle voices are wrong.
Aaaaah. I dont know if I can do this.....I couldn't here those notes to save my life and I have a good ear for heaven's sake! :P
I currently have a half done arrangement of this. I found the voices with painstaking trial and error plus an equalizer. I'm sure you can do it, it's great practice!
I agree! I'm not gonna stop till this arrangement is on the site! :)
Quote from: Deku Trombonist on February 06, 2015, 11:19:28 PMThe B double flats should be A naturals.
Quote from: InsigTurtle on February 06, 2015, 11:15:43 PMJust wondering, why doesn't the first part use F minor as its key signature?
Also, in m. 3, the last ornament should be a Db grace note and an F.
Got this stuff fixed. Links in OP fixed.
Still gotta get that middle part (voices) fixed.....that's 14-21 thats needs fixed right?
Any help with that would be great!
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 07, 2015, 09:39:50 AMStill gotta get that middle part (voices) fixed.....that's 14-21 thats needs fixed right?
Any help with that would be great!
Pretty much the whole thing, also, write them out in different layers, they don't have the same rhythm. The left hand is correct, but the rhythm is off for the A section.
Which measures?
Ooooooooook!
Here we go. Is this better?
I included every voice I heard....after about fiddling with it for an hour :P
(Links in OP)
Any feedback anyone? :)
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 07, 2015, 10:30:57 AM(Links in OP)
Super Maria Lego Fan...
What The Hell Is An OP
Quote from: King Sammer on February 09, 2015, 03:44:30 PMSuper Maria Lego Fan...
What The Hell Is An OP
Yes, Maria... Please tell us.
Original Post
Remember, Google is your friend.
OP = Original Post.
Quote from: Maelstrom on February 09, 2015, 03:59:26 PMOriginal Post
Remember, Google is your friend.
Who would ever need a friend if he has you?
lol
Ok.....SOOOOO.....feedback? :)
I decided making adjustments myself because talking through them by posting would take too long and not get far. Here's the mus of my suggested improvements (https://www.dropbox.com/s/p315m2almtneqw3/Sammer%27s%20Kingdom%20%28Nacho2420%20edits%29.mus?dl=0). Hope they help.
-nacho
PS what I do to check for accuracy is to play the mus file simultaneously with the original audio. I caught the wrong bass notes immediately that way. Tempo marking is on point so kudos to you guys ;D Very cool piece and good arrangement!
Thanks a lot!
Thanks Again, Nacho! Links in OP fixed.
And here I always thought it meant Opening Post... :P
So, updaters whatch think? Accepted? :)
Pretty good! Lots better than every other sheet and cover I could find on the internet.
*Mark both hands to be played one octave higher than written in measures 2-5. This will also have the side benefit of allowing more space to be between the trill above the C on beat 2 of measure 4 and the low F of measure 1, which are currently colliding.
*Speaking of colliding, the trill in the LH of measure 4 is sitting right inside the note itself!
*There's a super redundant re-statement of the key at m. 6. I'm sure you didn't mean to.
*You have separate dynamics written for measure 2 of the LH and RH, but they are identical, so I would delete the bottom one because it's redundant
*I feel your tempo markings are very "mechanical" - that is, they are very precise numbers like 108 without any indication of mood. This doesn't feel like a mechanical sort of song with demanding a metronome to play exactly 83 and then exactly 108. Consider (keyword is consider - e.g. not mandatory) rounding the numbers and give some text like "regally" or "with pomp". You may not have an expression tool in Notepad, but you do have a text tool that can do the exact same thing.
*Consider writing a new dynamic or expression beginning at m. 14 to help highlight the addition of the extra harmony.
*Also w/ m. 14 -- Remember that talk we had on your Mushroom Gorge sheet about not letting voices "disappear"? In beat 4, the lower voice disappears on beat 4.5, but this can be remedied if you write the lower A as a quarter note in the 2nd layer.
*M. 20 and 21 - The lower voice of the RH overlaps a lot with the melody, and sounds really muddled up. I highly recommend moving it down an octave and have the LH play it, as this would help make both the sound and the presentation cleaner.
*M. 23 - Disappearing voice again on beat 4.5! Use a double stem (in Notepad this can be done using a 2nd layer and then hiding all the preceding rests [and by hiding, I mean moving them so far off the page they won't be printed, since Notepad doesn't let you do "H" force hide)
*M. 27 - There's a double natural on beat 3??? I'm pretty sure it's just Finale being stupid about not combining accidentals from separate layers. Unfortunately, I know of no workaround in Notepad for this, so someone may have to eliminate that one for you.
*M. 30-33 ~~ That LH rhythm does not use tuplets. It goes "eighth, dotted 16th, 32nd", then a rest, then it repeats. Speaking of the rest, I would recommend playing a note there to emulate the percussion that strikes on those beats (that note could just be replaying the lowest note of the synth line).
Ok! I'll get on this tomorrow.....when I get on my computer! :)
Quote from: Bespinben on February 11, 2015, 05:06:58 PM*Speaking of colliding, the trill in the LH of measure 4 is sitting right inside the note itself!
*You have separate dynamics written for measure 2 of the LH and RH, but they are identical, so I would delete the bottom one because it's redundant
*Consider writing a new dynamic or expression beginning at m. 14 to help highlight the addition of the extra harmony.
*Also w/ m. 14 -- Remember that talk we had on your Mushroom Gorge sheet about not letting voices "disappear"? In beat 4, the lower voice disappears on beat 4.5, but this can be remedied if you write the lower A as a quarter note in the 2nd layer.
*M. 20 and 21 - The lower voice of the RH overlaps a lot with the melody, and sounds really muddled up. I highly recommend moving it down an octave and have the LH play it, as this would help make both the sound and the presentation cleaner.
*M. 23 - Disappearing voice again on beat 4.5! Use a double stem (in Notepad this can be done using a 2nd layer and then hiding all the preceding rests [and by hiding, I mean moving them so far off the page they won't be printed, since Notepad doesn't let you do "H" force hide)
*M. 30-33 ~~ That LH rhythm does not use tuplets. It goes "eighth, dotted 16th, 32nd", then a rest, then it repeats. Speaking of the rest, I would recommend playing a note there to emulate the percussion that strikes on those beats (that note could just be replaying the lowest note of the synth line).
Fixed all this stuff.
Quote from: Bespinben on February 11, 2015, 05:06:58 PM*There's a super redundant re-statement of the key at m. 6. I'm sure you didn't mean to.
Darn, I don't know how to fix this with notepad. Can you get it?
Quote from: Bespinben on February 11, 2015, 05:06:58 PM*M. 27 - There's a double natural on beat 3??? I'm pretty sure it's just Finale being stupid about not combining accidentals from separate layers. Unfortunately, I know of no workaround in Notepad for this, so someone may have to eliminate that one for you.
I can't get this with notepad. Can you get it please?
Quote from: Bespinben on February 11, 2015, 05:06:58 PM*I feel your tempo markings are very "mechanical" - that is, they are very precise numbers like 108 without any indication of mood. This doesn't feel like a mechanical sort of song with demanding a metronome to play exactly 83 and then exactly 108. Consider (keyword is consider - e.g. not mandatory) rounding the numbers and give some text like "regally" or "with pomp". You may not have an expression tool in Notepad, but you do have a text tool that can do the exact same thing.
Again, I can't change this with notepad
Quote from: Bespinben on February 11, 2015, 05:06:58 PM*Mark both hands to be played one octave higher than written in measures 2-5. This will also have the side benefit of allowing more space to be between the trill above the C on beat 2 of measure 4 and the low F of measure 1, which are currently colliding.
Can't get this either :/
Thanks for the feedback! If someone can just get these 4 things for me. It'll be accepted! :)
Can anyone help me with this stuff?? I'd like to get this one in with the update.
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 12, 2015, 11:38:39 AMCan anyone help me with this stuff?? I'd like to get this one in with the update.
Sorry already wanted to. Will do so in the next hour!
Quote from: Xaoz on February 12, 2015, 11:41:04 AMSorry already wanted to. Will do so in the next hour!
Ok! Thanks!
You have Finale 2012 full version?
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 12, 2015, 11:45:00 AMOk! Thanks!
You have Finale 2012 full version?
No, just wisdow.
Actually my wisdow seems to lack, since I cannot change the double # problem of measure 27. You would need to edit cross layer accidentals and my Finale cannot do it... Seems I need to buy the full version...
Please check if I actually got the stuff right or forgot something:
deleted
edited because of possible stupidity...
Quote from: Xaoz on February 12, 2015, 12:50:19 PMPlease check if I actually got the stuff right or forgot something:
I think you moved the notes up a few steps short of an octave. I thought Bespinben was just referring to moving the first few measures up, though?
Quote from: Latios212 on February 12, 2015, 01:27:46 PMI think you moved the notes up a few steps short of an octave. I thought Bespinben was just referring to moving the first few measures up, though?
I actually just moved up measure 2-5. Atleast I thought so... Uhm did Finale do it for the whole piece? :D Haha, my bad need to check... Sorry!
ok.....
Is there anyone out there with full 2012?
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 12, 2015, 01:56:13 PMIs there anyone out there with full 2012?
You just found the right guy.
Quote from: King Sammer on February 12, 2015, 01:58:33 PMYou just found the right guy.
I laughed.
Will still upload corrected version soon, just give me a few mins...
edit:
Here it is:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r5oh0n3j0z92yo3/Super%20Paper%20Mario%20-%20Sammer%27s%20Kingdom.mus?dl=0
Hope I did not mess up again :D Tricky Finale!
Thanks!
Accepted Bespinben? :)
M. 27 still not alright.
Natural thingy?
Ahhhhh.
Bespinben will have to get it then.....
Fixed that and cleaned it up a little more. I think it should be good to go now.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93589150/Super%20Paper%20Mario%20-%20Sammer%27s%20Kingdom.mus
Thanks!
Ok Bespinben!
Everything is fixed.....for sure! :)
Quote from: JDMEK5 on February 12, 2015, 04:42:16 PMFixed that and cleaned it up a little more. I think it should be good to go now.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/93589150/Super%20Paper%20Mario%20-%20Sammer%27s%20Kingdom.mus
I like it how you get ALL the notes; even the ones that were not gotten in any of the other version. :D
OK!
Accepted?
Oh my. So much better. Relief. Thank you JDMEK.
Just a few more nitpicky things:
*Could you put a suggested tempo number with parentheses for moderato, like you did with andantino?
*In m. 5-7 and 14-16, in the LH, the slurs seem awfully close to the staccatissimo markings. Mark them so that the staccatissimo markings are above the slur, like with the normal staccato + slur combos at m. 10 and 11.
*Add some staccatos to the LH at m. 30-32 where necessary.
Maybe I should leave critiques one at a time so that way each time we fix it, MLF will say "accepted now?" Sorry MLF if you read this, I just think it's funny (the importunity)
Oh, I didn't even notice your post Xaoz! I read the thread from the bottom up, so I just stopped at JDMEK's link. That would explain my wisdow senses tingling as I read the revised arrangement...
Quote from: Bespinben on February 12, 2015, 08:15:43 PMOh my. So much better. Relief. Thank you JDMEK.
Just a few more nitpicky things:
*Could you put a suggested tempo number with parentheses for moderato, like you did with andantino?
*In m. 5-7 and 14-16, in the LH, the slurs seem awfully close to the staccatissimo markings. Mark them so that the staccatissimo markings are above the slur, like with the normal staccato + slur combos at m. 10 and 11.
*Add some staccatos to the LH at m. 30-32 where necessary.
Maybe I should leave critiques one at a time so that way each time we fix it, MLF will say "accepted now?" Sorry MLF if you read this, I just think it's funny (the importunity)
I'll get to it when I get on my computer tomorrow! :)
This stuff would take 5 seconds to fix. Would someone like to take care of this now for me? I'm in bed :P
Quote from: Bespinben on February 12, 2015, 08:22:48 PMOh, I didn't even notice your post Xaoz!
:'( :'( Our love is over!
Quote from: Bespinben on February 12, 2015, 08:15:43 PMOh my. So much better. Relief. Thank you JDMEK.
Just a few more nitpicky things:
*Could you put a suggested tempo number with parentheses for moderato, like you did with andantino?
*In m. 5-7 and 14-16, in the LH, the slurs seem awfully close to the staccatissimo markings. Mark them so that the staccatissimo markings are above the slur, like with the normal staccato + slur combos at m. 10 and 11.
*Add some staccatos to the LH at m. 30-32 where necessary.
Maybe I should leave critiques one at a time so that way each time we fix it, MLF will say "accepted now?" Sorry MLF if you read this, I just think it's funny (the importunity)
Fixed.
Nooooow accepted? :)
Quote from: mariolegofan on February 13, 2015, 09:35:13 AMFixed.
Nooooow accepted? :)
You do not want me as an enemy, MLF.
Just remember, attention to the smallest of aesthetic details goes a long way.
This submission has been accepted by Bespinben (http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2510).
~Zeta, your friendly NSM-Bot