NinSheetMusic Forums

Hello everybody, please be prepared for a bit of a rant here.

Let's face it, the site moves at snail's pace at the moment. Uploads about twice a season, except for the summer. Most of the forum
activity is condensed in one topic. Senior members leaving, new ones not staying. We're not a big site, but there is potential to do
so much more. Also, the infrequent updates and anonymous community may keep possible contributors from ever contacting us. We're an archive as if ran by an institution, but there's a community behind it. I have a few suggestions that could help us get more
recognition:

 - More uploaders (preferable two more). At the moment, there are three people here (I think) with access to the uploader script.
However, these are people with a life outside NSM, and never get enough spare time to revise and upload the submitted sheets. It
doesn't exactly help either that only one of them will take responsibility for updating at a time. I think we should establish an
uploader team, with specific guidelines to follow, such as the formatting of sheets. The team members don't need forum moderator
powers (at least outside the Submission subforum), but a team with knowledge, a goal and guidelines is better than a single mod doing
the task. This team would also be responsible for keeping track of the "fulfilling the requests" competition.

 - Next, establish proper guidelines for uploading. That includes a strict keeping to schedules. For example, a set day of the
month updates are set to be on. Sweeping, with comments, will be done by the team continously (read: Whenever a team member gets
time, he can revise a post and write "approved by (member name)"), and the submission thread will be closed for submissions two days
before the update is set to take place.

 - Also, as the amount of "classic" unarranged songs are spiralling towards zero, I think we should establish a new section of the
site dedicated to full arrangements. There are plenty of them lying around in various threads by now. There should also be a note
somewhere that it's less likely that a full arrangement request will be taken than a piano one, if any. They are arranged, formatted
according to the guidelines, why shouldn't we upload them if we get the arranger's permission?

 - Many people go to other sites instead of NSM because they have to download a dedicated program to view our sheets (which in turn
they'll have to register for to download). I suggest that we add .pdf-files to the sheets, or at least a selected few (main themes
from well-known games, for example). If the download counts are affected, we can expand on the concept. I know, there is a lot of
work in converting and uploading 1300 files, but if we start with ten or twenty, it wouldn't be much of an issue.

 - Promoting NSM some way would be cool too. A bunch of people here are active on other forums, and if we just ask them politely to
mention NSM in some way, we might get more visitors. Also, if we finish that video project, it will be good PR.

 - Make the community more visible. If we create a "members" subforum, only visible to registered members, we could have a little
more privacy. On the other forum I use, this subforum is very popular, with the "photos of members" thread getting a thousand visits
a week or so. Competitions would be nice too, or annual "member awards" (with categories such as best arranger, best newcomer, most
friendly, most knowledgeable, etc).

What do you think?

What shall I say? I support your proposals... NSM needs to be changed!!!

Agreed. I don't see the problem with any of these points. They all seem great.

Hmm...I'm all for expansion. I would offer my services for the Uploading Team, but I know nothing about scripts, very little about computers in general. I could help review though the files though and provide a PDF if needed as I review.

But we need approval of the mighty JaMaHa for the ultimate say.

Uploaders might be hard to find, but to find people who can at least sift through arrangements will be easy.

Quote from: MaestroUGC on April 10, 2010, 01:56:01 PMI know nothing about scripts, very little about computers in general

There isn't really anything involved that requires extensive knowledge about computers.  It's all done through a form.  The part of uploading that takes time and effort is going through the sheets.

-More uploaders seems like a reasonable idea.  That's not up to me though.
-Strict keeping of a schedule will never work out.  Just trust me on this one.  For a few weeks, a new person will be all gung-ho about updating and do it regularly, but then they'll find excuses...  They'll always find excuses.  Unless they literally have no life in which case bring them on board.
-I think there's still plenty of music that hasn't been arranged for piano.  I'm not totally opposed to full arrangements, I just don't know what the best way to implement them would be.
-I see your point about the PDFs.  Seems like a reasonable idea, though I don't want to be the one who has to update all 1300 sheets with a PDF file. :P  When you think about it, Finale Reader really is an excessively inconvenient program to download.
-Promotion is great.  Word of mouth is really the best (free) advertising we can get.  Just tell people about the site.  An easy thing to do would be to invite friends on Facebook to join the fan page.
-Your last point is kind of a contradiction, suggesting a more visible community by making a members-only thread, but I see what you mean.  I don't really know how much that would boost membership or community activity, but it would be easy enough to implement, I would imagine.  Competitions likely won't happen, because no one likes a contest with no prizes, and we have no way to obtain prizes.  Member awards could be neat, and would be a great way for an interested member to do their part to promote activity (a community member could easily run something like that).

Well, you're definitely right. I support all the changes you propose.

I know 1300 .pdf-files is the online version of a container full of laundry. But say that we first try it out for a few well-known songs, such as the SMB overworld theme, the LoZ main theme, the Pokémon main theme and a few more. I don't know if there is a way to view download statistics, but if the DL count for these .pdfs are notably higher than other songs, we could expand to a few more popular songs.

The "member forum" is mostly not to get new members, but to keep the old. After all, veterans are often the glue that sticks the community together. If we manage to get a site "culture", newcomers would find it easier to fit in here too.

Concerning the schedule of uploading, I hope a team would be more effective than a single uploader taking the responsibility of starting update threads, setting deadlines, sweep and upload. If all the files are approved by a given deadline, it's just for the uploader to do just that: upload. Regular deadlines (say, the first day of each month) would also be easier to keep. Approving files may be a chore, but if it can be condensed into "look at a post if I have five empty minutes", it might be easier. That way, it becomes a regular activity, rather than a full sweep that has to be completed in one sitting.

This site needs to be changed (I skimmed through :P), that's true. But, it all goes back to JaMaHa's word...

I really don't understand any of you, I really don't. I'm absolutely flustered.

Do you think nothing like this has happened before? Why do you think people are going to other sites? Why do you think all the veteran members didn't stick around?

In fact, I seem to recall something happening like this roughly a year ago. Something exactly like this. A few NSM members saw exactly what you saw; extreme lapses of productivity. And they tried doing something about it.

They had everything at their disposal that NSM needed. But NSM didn't want it. They didn't let it go to waste. They did something about everything they brought up. Everyone else who agreed with them followed.

I'm going to fill this quote box with everything that happened, if its mentioned in this thread.

Quote"More uploaders (preferable two more)"
"I think we should establish an uploader team, with specific guidelines to follow, such as the formatting of sheets."
"a team with knowledge, a goal and guidelines"
"Sweeping, with comments, will be done by the team continously"
"a new section of the site dedicated to full arrangements."
"add .pdf-files to the sheets"
"Promoting NSM some way would be cool too."
"photos of members thread"
"annual member awards"
"download statistics"
"it becomes a regular activity, rather than a full sweep that has to be completed in one sitting."
"veterans are often the glue that sticks the community together"
"a site culture"

And then, to top things off, those members operated in a way that didn't take from NSM, nor did they try to harm NSM in anyway. In fact, after they had gone off and done their thing, they still tried to help NSM. They still offered to do such things as submissions, or clean through sheets, or what have you.

Yet you all turn your noses up when you hear any mention of it. You look at it as something dirty, as something less, as something menacing, when in fact, the entire thing is built upon EVERYTHING you suggest now.

Clicky (http://www.vgvirtuoso.net)

And notice I'm still here. I haven't left. In fact, we're all here, to some degree. For god's sake, I'm still staff. I'm in the chatroom every single day, still with that power to moderate its users. To be fair, even the few users who go their are either chatroom staff, or our members.

It pisses a lot of us off that had to have happened before, and now its happening again. As a matter of fact, we're still trying to help.

I'm very glad someone (two people even) brought this up:

Quote from: universe-X on April 10, 2010, 04:42:21 PMThis site needs to be changed (I skimmed through :P), that's true. But, it all goes back to JaMaHa's word...

Quote from: MaestroUGC on April 10, 2010, 01:56:01 PMBut we need approval of the mighty JaMaHa for the ultimate say.

I want you all to guess what he said one year ago.

I'm sorry if I come off as some egotistical dick (I'm not trying to, I'm really not), but everything I say is the truth, and quite honestly, you all need a slap in the face.

^^A bit over-exaggerated and pessimistic imo.

It's not that this hasn't happened before, but we think if this stuff is added to NSM, then more people will come.

I remember coming here and wanting to play the sheets, and I found out I had to pay for Finale to use them. Then I looked elsewhere for PDF's and only came back here for MIDI's... I honestly would've forgot about this site if it hadn't been for UGC's submissions and the updates were popping up like they do now.

And if that's how the veteran members left, so be it. Who knows? Maybe more will come with these advancements.

And I do recall JMH calling this off. Doesn't mean we still can't try...

Can you give us any idea of people who left to VGVirtuoso that are still somewhat contributing here, please? The only I've seen is Sirus (somewhat, I don't know if he even goes there) and Ingus...

Just my $0.02

^That's not what Hugo is saying. What he is saying is that we have everything to make the changes ourselves. It's just if we really wanted to, that we could get our lazy asses and start working.

Plus, how would you know whether Hugo is exaggerating or not? Or even, who cares? The point is, we shouldn't make a big deal out of this because all it's going to do is cause problems for the site and its members.

Lets focus on what the site is made for; The sheets.

Quote from: Brassman388 on April 10, 2010, 06:56:26 PMPlus, how would you know whether Hugo is exaggerating or not? Or even, who cares? The point is, we shouldn't make a big deal out of this because all it's going to do is cause problems for the site and its members.

Wow, aren't you psychic...

Yes. Yes I am.

Goddammit, Hugo is right and you know it.  Just like how he has been right on the majority of other similar points.

People are going to lose interest, there is not a big enough community OVERALL to give this site a giant boost to megaforum status, and those little awards and crap only work when you have a ton of active members, which we don't have.

Also, you registered in fucking January, that alone should make everything you're saying here invalid.

Cobraroll: Except for, perhaps, the last point, I don't think anybody would say these are bad ideas. But it's strange how universally good ideas fail to be implemented. Then you remember that even the simplest improvements take work.

Nothing has changed on NSM in the past year, except the addition of submission threads (where people now submit a limited number of songs to a single update thread). And all this time, people have been eager and excited to see changes. The number of posts in this thread serves as evidence to that. You might ask why there have been no changes, but the answer can be found by scrolling upwards a bit. To save you the trouble, here's a quote:

Quote from: Nintendude73 on April 10, 2010, 02:17:54 PMThat's not up to me though.

The people who want to see the changes, are not the ones capable of bringing about the changes. I don't know who is, but if NSM is ever to be rescued from this stagnancy, the person in charge is going to have to be the one to do it. But if they aren't going to drive, they should hand over the keys.


I think it would be easier if the upload team didn't do "batch" updates. It makes it seem like a chore. Rather, there could be a rolling update thread, and the uploaders would simply go down in order, and do as many as they can whenever they have time. People could be limited a bit, in the amount of posts they could make in this thread. This eliminates the excuse of laziness for the updaters - how long does it take to do just one song?

Also, the PDF issue could be solved in the same way the "fixing the sheets" threads work. If every active member worked for a half hour, I bet the project could be taken care of quite easily.




Finally, listen to Hugo. The man knows what he's talking about.

(Try and botherbotherbother Dekudude to make NSM a better uploader)

(Good luck)

Quote from: KefkaticFanatic on April 10, 2010, 11:02:20 PMGoddammit, Hugo is right and you know it.  Just like how he has been right on the majority of other similar points.

I wasn't saying he was wrong.

Quote from: KefkaticFanatic on April 10, 2010, 11:02:20 PMAlso, you registered in fucking January, that alone should make everything you're saying here invalid.

Why does this matter?

^^He was pointing towards Cobra.

Everyone has their own insight on this. If only our ADMINISTRATOR were active enough to see this...

Everyone should listen to Hugo.

I've been away from NSM for months, working on VGV. When I came back about a week ago, I found everything at standstill. Updates are few and far between around here, despite all the great work being done by the arrangers. Great ideas seem to be cropping up, like the video project, but they don't seem to be going very far.

Now, I love NSM. I got my start here a couple of years back, and I've been using the site since long before G-Han left. I care about this site, and I would hate to see it die off. The rest of the staff at VGV feels the same way.

JaMaHa, you know what we're thinking about.

Quote from: Sir Awesomesauce on April 10, 2010, 11:04:41 PMYou might ask why there have been no changes, but the answer can be found by scrolling upwards a bit. To save you the trouble, here's a quote:

Quote from: Nintendude73 on April 10, 2010, 04:17:54 PM
That's not up to me though.

The people who want to see the changes, are not the ones capable of bringing about the changes. I don't know who is, but if NSM is ever to be rescued from this stagnancy, the person in charge is going to have to be the one to do it. But if they aren't going to drive, they should hand over the keys.

Umm... it isn't up to me though.  I really don't have any power besides doing updates.  And even if I wanted to I couldn't give the people who want power (and could do something with it) the power they want.  Besides, is there anyone here who is even capable of coding everything that you all want?  That's the person we need to be giving some power.

I'm really all for change, since that's what people seem to want.  I just can't do a whole lot about it outside of updating more, and I'll try to take into consideration some of the ideas being thrown around with regards to that.

I would post another link, but that would be beating a dead horse.

Yes, yes it would, just like it has been every time you've posted a link to it.  If you were given the abilities to deal with the site's code, would you do something about it?  And if you would, why haven't you already talked to JaMaHa about it?

I did so, one year ago.

Hmm...

NSM staff, among others, would like to know how many people here pushing for full arrangements actually do full arrangements.

Choices are simple enough:

"Yes, I've done some sheets" - only vote this if you can prove it.
"No, but I would like to" - best for those who play other instruments besides piano.
"No, just piano" - easy enough, piano only.

Please, do not vote if you don't arrange at all.

Gj Hugo. I support you fully.

Everyone else: Suck it up and deal with the fact that there won't be full arrangements here. For god's sake, just go to Vgv or Apollomix or someplace else where you can bitch about your shit like this.

In other words, shut up.

Ooh, saucy

Sir Awesomesauce is more saucy than that post.

Okay, KF, I registered in January. Last year. I was a lurker for a bit before then, but not long. Still, I'd say I've been around since we recovered from the site crash.

Hugo, I think you are right on many of your points, possibly all of them. The poll is a good idea. I will wait and see, and have another say when I have more time and energy to reply.

Am I really the only one that voted, "No, but I would like to..." ?

No, there are invisible votes that only cool people like me can see.

Quote from: KefkaticFanatic on April 12, 2010, 05:56:27 PM...cool people like me...

*chuckle*chuckle*

The poll is just to gather info, no guarantee anything will come out of it... and we're not gathering info for the reason you probably think we are.  ;)

Good to know :)

ruh roh

This reminds me... wasn't Nakah talking about some kind of master plan or something?

Woaaah.  A lot of text there....maybe I'll read it sometime later; but from the 3 second skimming I did, I saw more uploaders!  .PDF's!  More people!  Seriously though, I told....maybe I didn't tell you guys; but there are going to be some changes in the coming month.  So be prepared.

Actually, with Nakah stepping in, there are actually three uploaders (four if we somehow count G-Han, five with JaMaHa). If their internal communication is good enough, I can possibly call myself satisfied on that point.

Also, Concerto, I'm excited for this. Good to hear that there are concrete plans, that was possibly the key point of my rant. The way NSM has been for some time, may best be summed up with "unorganized". Good to hear that something is in the works.

Quote from: Cobraroll on April 15, 2010, 02:58:03 AMActually, with Nakah stepping in, there are actually three uploaders (four if we somehow count G-Han, five with JaMaHa). If their internal communication is good enough, I can possibly call myself satisfied on that point.

Guan is gone and I don't update.

Quote from: Concerto No.20 in D minor on April 15, 2010, 01:06:37 AMSeriously though, I told....maybe I didn't tell you guys; but there are going to be some changes in the coming month.  So be prepared.

Wait, what?

YAY!!! CHANGE!  BLESS YOU, CONCERTO NO. 20 IN D MINOR BY MOZART!  :'(

Quote from: JaMaHa on April 15, 2010, 04:09:50 AMGuan is gone and I don't update.

Guan is gone? Where is he?

http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=1025.0

I'm here to throw my knowledge in. And to start things off, I have been here for a long time, August of 2007 to be exact. I remember the old users that have come and gone. I remember the_grimace splitting off. I remember BK-Pianist splitting off. NSM has made a huge impact in my life, if it wasn't for the site, I wouldn't have some of the great friends I have today. But, at the same time, letting things go can be necessary to move on. As Dude mentioned: http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=1025.0 (http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=1025.0). He had other things to do, several of us have other things to do too. I can understand it being difficult to maintain a site run like this, so at that point, people succumb to laziness.

Over the years, it seems as if NSM was based on quantity, not quality. Look at some of the sheets, can you say that they are humanly possible to play? I can blatantly say that I've looked at sheets on here, and gone and learned it on my own, because the sheets were not pleasant (or even possible) to read from. Asides from being difficult, some of them are wrong. You can tell when people have directly copied from a midi too, with either terrible notation or completely wrong rhythms. I don't know why the uploading staff let this go. I'd rather have fewer correct sheets than multiple bad sheets.

With that being said, I am essentially ready to see NSM go, but I am reluctant. I'd like to see it stay. But, there seems to be no drive to keep it around by those that can do what is needed to be done. What needs to be done?

• Well, to start, we need to clean up the sheets. ALL of them. Wait, hasn't this been done before? http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=1443.0 (http://www.ninsheetm.us/smf/index.php?topic=1443.0) Yes, it was attempted, note the "Project II" in the title. Like Hugo said, this has all been tried before. Look what happened in that topic, they gave up, and accepted that it was just going to happen. Thanks to DekuTrombonist for continuing that. But one person can't check and fix over 1000 sheets. We need to start a topic like that, and have veterans check each sheet, section by section. Tedious? Quite, but it would need to be done.
• Next, we need a better way to upload. A select few cannot be assigned a task to go through with checking several topics just to find a few good sheets. This has been fixed slightly by having a submission topic. But it can, and should, go further than that. A user uploader should be implemented. www.vgvirtuoso.net (http://www.vgvirtuoso.net) has a great uploader, I've used it. The concept of it is great, someone wants to submit a sheet? They go to the uploader, and there, it's done. Wait, what about bad sheets going on like that? Have an admin staff check them. Just a few people are all that's needed. SIMPLE.
• So, we've had mention of PDF again? well, that wouldn't be difficult at all to code into the site. Only issue is that there are so many files to make PDF's of. Simple solution? Yes there is, it fits along with the user uploader and the veterans checking each sheet. It can be done, just it'd take time.

Well, obviously, I seem to have a solution. Wait, it seems there has always been a solution. But there isn't enough care for that solution to be seen through. Lets take a look at what has been said by Hugo.

Quote from: HugoMeister on April 10, 2010, 05:13:59 PM

Quote"More uploaders (preferable two more)"
"I think we should establish an uploader team, with specific guidelines to follow, such as the formatting of sheets."
"a team with knowledge, a goal and guidelines"
"Sweeping, with comments, will be done by the team continuously"
"a new section of the site dedicated to full arrangements."
"add .pdf-files to the sheets"
"Promoting NSM some way would be cool too."
"photos of members thread"
"annual member awards"
"download statistics"
"it becomes a regular activity, rather than a full sweep that has to be completed in one sitting."
"veterans are often the glue that sticks the community together"
"a site culture"

And then, to top things off, those members operated in a way that didn't take from NSM, nor did they try to harm NSM in anyway. In fact, after they had gone off and done their thing, they still tried to help NSM. They still offered to do such things as submissions, or clean through sheets, or what have you.

I'm going to go through them one by one. Lets see what happens.

"I think we should establish an uploader team, with specific guidelines to follow, such as the formatting of sheets."
I've already covered this, an uploader team cannot stay constant.

"a team with knowledge, a goal and guidelines"
This doesn't come together in the end. We start a team, and it falls through. Look at the video project.

"Sweeping, with comments, will be done by the team continuously"
Again, previously covered. It won't be continuously .

"a new section of the site dedicated to full arrangements."
I'm not sure if you realize how that could work on the way this site is set up. Where would we put them? I'd be all for LOOKING INTO it, after we fix up what we have though. No need to dig a bigger hole for ourselves.

"add .pdf-files to the sheets"
Previously covered.

"Promoting NSM some way would be cool too."
Sure, go ahead and promote that NSM has faulty sheets and links. We need to fix first. We have people, but they won't do the work.

"photos of members thread"
Honestly, I'd like someone to explain how on earth this would help NSM.

"annual member awards"
For what? And what would be given? Honestly, people should do this because they like doing this. They shouldn't need any more motivation.

"download statistics"
Great, so we know whats popular. Besides this being slightly useless to actually fixing NSM, we could gather data on what people want.... Wait, we have a request forum. I must have forgotten about that.

"it becomes a regular activity, rather than a full sweep that has to be completed in one sitting."
So, do any of you have time in your day (EVERY day), to sit down and take 30 minutes to focus on doing uploads?

"veterans are often the glue that sticks the community together"
Well, it appears it's the only thing REMAINING holding this community together.

"veterans are often the glue that sticks the community together"
IRC is home to many cultures that most of you don't even realize exist. Hugo and I go way back, and I doubt very many of you actually know who Zeta is.

THERE, well, as you can see. Nothing said there is going to help, it's already been done and tried. We need to try something new. In all honesty, there is a lot of coding that is broken on the main site too. I don't know how many of you have found it, but I've found a lot that should be changed. So, what do I propose? Lets formally start something. Not just another topic that will die. Let's put together a team of people that are able to stick around to fix things, or at least get things done. NSM is my birthplace essentially, I don't want to see it die.

Now, who do I suggest for this team of people? Well, the veterans, people that JaMaHa deem necessary, and people through nomination. Let's hear everyone's opinion on this topic. If there is a demand. I will find a place for a topic. Think this through again, we still need someone to code the site. I'll volunteer to put time into that, I can get done what I have time for, but in order to code for NSM. I would need JaMaHa's approval. All of this needs JaMaHa's approval.

It appears as if NSM's life is being held in JaMaHa's hands. Everything is revolving around him. For that reason. I would like to speak to you, JaMaHa. Send me a PM or a Memo on IRC. It's your choice. We need your help to save NSM. As we can't function as two individual groups. All I am asking for, is a talk right now. Let's just forget the formal plans. I would like to speak to you about saving this site. If that cannot be done. I am able right now, to leave NSM and permanently migrate to VGV (http://www.vgvirtuoso.net), and I would encourage all of you to do the same. That site is being run by magnificent admins. They won't let that site die anytime soon, if ever. And I'm sure they already have plans of what would happen if it did start to die off.

Just to finish off that wall of text, to get a start on a team that is worthy of taking some time to fix up NSM if they so wish. I nominate KefkaFanatic, DekuTrombonist, myself, along with the staff. Who do you think deserves the responsibility to save NSM?

Yeah, responsibility.  Everyone knows I'm responsible.

Also, I like Apollomix's uploader too.

I would like to help to fix the site. I am not really a bad arranger...
And I totally agree with you master_gamer38. But you should make an own thread for it...

Well put master_gamer38. And yes, there are only so many arrangements I can fix before I want to throw my keyboard at something...

Dahans: If you want to help fix the site, pick a game and start re-arranging all the crappy arrangements from that game that are on the site (If you can be bothered). Don't forget to let us know which game you picked by way of the Fixing the Sheets Project thread.

Kefka: I also like Apollomix's uploader but if a similar system was to be implemented here, perhaps it could do with an "Add to Existing Section" / "Create New Section" option to at least go a little way to preventing human error

Quote from: Maretocks on April 21, 2010, 01:40:32 AMThe 3 Brawl arrangements are under Suoer Smash Bros Brawl.

Quote"photos of members thread"
Honestly, I'd like someone to explain how on earth this would help NSM.

"annual member awards"
For what? And what would be given? Honestly, people should do this because they like doing this. They shouldn't need any more motivation.

Okay, I'll adress your points. Thank you for taking the time to read.

First and foremost, those were loose suggestions. As you might have seen, other suggestions were a lot more on-topic, and these were at the bottom of the list.

The reason why I put them there, is that the other forum I frequent has a Member-only subforum where everything is off-topic (It's the coasterforce.com forums, if you wonder). It's the place where in-jokes are born, continued and eventually doze off only to be resurrected five years later. It's not relevant to the site at all, but as the forum isn't public, it has more of a relaxed attitude than the rest of the site. It's the place where members call each other by first names, share stories about their everyday doings, and support each other when times get tough. We get to know each other there, and many old members still venture the Member subforum, even though they "couldn't give a flying poo about coasters anymore", as one member put it. Basically, if the site is an office where people sit in their cubicles to work all day, the Member forum is the annual company BBQ party.

Basically, it helps integrating new members, and keep the old ones to stay. The member awards are basically a tradition, though the title "Best new member" or "Gamesmaster" can give the winner more respect.

But as I said, loose suggestions. NSM might be a too small community for this at the moment, and the PYTOTM thread may be sufficent for now.

People won't know me, since I only recently registered, but I've around on the site as a guest for quite a while now. Anyways...

Please read all of this post. Don't skim read it and don't read half.

This site has potential. Lots of it. We just need people who have the time/can be bothered to work at making it better. There are some amazing arrangements here, and I'm sure we don't want to see them go. I personally have quite a lot of time and would love to help out. I'd like to mention this:

There is no 'i' in 'team'.

We are a community. We are a team. It's not about one person, it's about everyone. But some people don't think of themselves making the effort, they think that others will do it instead. So maybe the phrase should be:

There is no 'u' (you) in 'team'.

In other words, people can't say 'you do it'. We all have to work together to help this community. I don't want to see it crash and burn. Do you?

I would like to help out. I would like to upload and fix sheets and anything else. Because I want to see this site prosper. (And if you don't know me enough to trust me, then that's fine)

I'm not trying to moan, or rant. I want to help. Please, help this site stay alive!

IMO you are trustworthy :D. I hope you will become part of the uploader team :D.

:( I've never done so much reading in a day...

Wow I am seriously late to this thread.

I found NSM through youtube actually. I had a sister learning the piano and she was skimming through some videos when someone linked to this site. I am actually not much of a musician, as I've only had a few horrible memories of music class as a kid, singing, playing the recorder and having everyone tease me, but I was really happy when I found this site where I could make up for those crappy experiences :D Also I've been lurking for a while but I finally got an account recently after seeing this Pokemon discussion. The drama was a bit scary sometimes though.


If no one minds, may I suggest that there be an easier way for newcomers to view the sheets? I agree with having pdfs but I'd do something about Finale Reader too. Installing Finale Reader is a pain in the ass, but it is a new way (to my friends to studied music without any computers) to see sheets. But I couldn't convince them to download it unless I made it easy for them by allowing them to access my account, so they'd skip the registration process. What if NSM had an account like that? I have not read the entire terms of service but since this is private use, would the the company mind?

I really think there are some good ideas out there. But arranging does take a lot of time than recording yourself on Youtube. It's going to need a lot more musicians and a lot more people with the tools to do it (Allegro,etc) before it turns into something like ...squaresound? (>>>a random google hit)

/rant

How is this a rant? I think you did a good job explaining... I completely agree with you.  We need to upload the finale download file onto NSM, since I think you can only download Finale Reader once... that would solve everything.  One file, over thousands of pdf files.  that is much simpler (of course, we would have to talk to Finale about that first). 

Yes, we need more musicians, and arrangers.  I'm going to start arranging.  I can tell you, I'm good with my ear.  Just not that good at playing  :P only on fur elise.  anyway, the point of this was that I completely agree with Ruto. 

There are other ways of getting Finale, you know. We just can't talk about it openly, nor can we make one whole NSM account. Too many expenses...

or is it?

I believe even with a teacher's account, you only get 35 copies. That won't work. Deal with finale reader. It works fine.

Yeah, I agree with that.


Lol, when I read the title, I thought the site was going to close. :P

fact: the site willl never close

Hopefully.

Converting to PDF's would be relatively easy. Relatively.  (http://www.herbalcell.com/make-sheet-music)

Basically-
-Requires the download of Notation Composer (MidiNotate Composer I think it's actually called.) Fantastic for editing MIDI's. Acquire at your own discretion. ;) I've used it before (I used a trial) and absolutely adored it.

-Requires the download of CutePDF Converter.

-Download the MIDI for the respective sheet, open in Notation Composer, File/Print, select CutePDF and it will convert to a PDF.

This allows the creator of the sheet to use Finale to create the sheet, then to save as a MIDI, then to convert to a PDF. Once you have all the preliminary stuff, implementing PDF's could be made incredibly easy, all it would take is a bit of dedicated effort to convert the current sheets.

Yeah, I know I don't arrange. I might contribute to the Fixing of the Sheets if I get time. :) /Hypocrisy confession

You've inserted a couple of unnecessary steps there. You only need to open the .mus file in Finale and then print it using CutePDF. Voila!

Anyway, if this whole PDF conversion idea comes to fruition, I'm quite happy to volunteer to do some converting.  ;)

Quote from: DekuTrombonist on June 01, 2010, 04:25:28 AMYou've inserted a couple of unnecessary steps there. You only need to open the .mus file in Finale and then print it using CutePDF. Voila!

Even easier. :D I never used Finale tho. :P I hear it's much easier if you use a digital piano as opposed to clicky clicky. :P

Quote from: DekuTrombonist on June 01, 2010, 04:25:28 AMAnyway, if this whole PDF conversion idea comes to fruition, I'm quite happy to volunteer to do some converting.  ;)

Same.

I wouldn't know about that, I can't play piano. I just "clicky clicky" my way through arranging.

That's the main reason I don't do it. :P

I used to play piano but I got out of practice D:

Quote from: Maretocks on June 01, 2010, 04:17:55 AMall it would take is a bit of dedicated effort to convert the current sheets.

There's where the problem lies.

Actually, I would happily volunteer if my PC hadn't broke down. Remind me of this post once I get a new one, will you?

Quote from: Cobraroll on June 01, 2010, 05:48:55 AMThere's where the problem lies.

There is also the problem of adding extra versions of arrangements which are crap to start off with. Hence, although I am quite willing to spend time converting sheets to Pdf's, I am reluctant to convert bad sheets that will hopefully be replaced anyway.

This place is one of the most underrated and unappreciated websites out there. There is an abundance of well-done sheet music and talented composers here. I've been coming here for years for my musical needs. I want to help you guys out. If there are any support banners, I'll gladly put them on my signature on forums (Nintendo Nsider, Pokecommunity, etc.) and help advertise. I'll also try to begin making contributions once I purchase a copy of Finale. Keep at it, guys, and don't give up -- this community is amazing.

Lol, Nsider.  I remember that.

Okay everybody.  In 3 weeks...THREE weeks, there is going to be a major project for NSM; and I'll need everyone's help.  I'll let you know more in 2 weeks.  : D

Three weeks...

*counts on fingers*

Darn, I'll be away for a week from the 26th on.

OMG, that sounds great!

I'm excited.

*Jumps happily*

I wish I could help.

Quote from: Oni-Link on June 06, 2010, 04:06:26 AMI wish I could help.

I'd type up a wartime propaganda speech right now, but it's late.

Quote from: Maretocks on June 06, 2010, 05:38:06 AMI'd type up a wartime propaganda speech right now, but it's late.

ololo

      As you said, the NSM community SHOULDN'T need the motivation of awards. However, not to be rude, but our community is a bit lazy, and along with that, the awards might prove to be a fun challenge to the members. I, personally, would enjoy trying really hard to make it on the record books for contributing to this website.

And although I don't arrange, I'll be glad to put 30 minutes aside whenever I can to help convert MUS's into PDF's. Or maybe an hour.
Project Code Name: MUS2PDFS  :D

Quote from: Concerto No.20 in D minor on June 06, 2010, 01:39:15 AMI'll let you know more in 2 weeks.  : D

14 days later...

You all should know by now that NOTHING here ever meets its deadline. :P

xD unfortunately you're right, I am waiting 2 weeks for the update...

Hmm just read through this thread entirely, and I gotta say some solid points have been made. As stated before, I'm not much of an arranger, but I really want to try hard to make some video's for the B&K community project, as well as convert sheets to PDF. Furthermore, I'm familiar with programming/web design, so I'm more than willing to help out in that area as well. For so long this website has been of great service to me; it's time to return the favor, well I'm looking forward to Concerto's project ^_^

I just read all of this.
I am in to help in any way possible. Let me know.
As sort of a veteran, I've seen people come and go. Nothing has changed, save the uploaders and their frequencies.
I came back this summer after seeing the viable option of "weekly updates" and that is not occurring at the moment. We need something that does viably work to change this site.
I will put the time into it and do whatever I can to keep this site alive.

Quote from: Nintendude73 on June 20, 2010, 12:13:33 PMYou all should know by now that NOTHING here ever meets its deadline. :P

All the more reason to nag! =D=D=D

I wish to join you on your quest to nag! :P

Quote from: DekuTrombonist on June 21, 2010, 04:36:09 AMI wish to join you on your quest to nag! :P

Jeeze you guys don't you realize that by 2 weeks I mean not 2 weeks!  I'm almost done making the preparations though.

Quote from: Concerto No.20 in D minor on June 25, 2010, 12:59:48 AMJeeze you guys don't you realize that by 2 weeks I mean 2 months!?  I'm almost done making the preparations though.

*Fixed. :P

I just read through this post. ive been a long time behind the scenes person here ( just downloading and playing... back in 2008 and stuff). i am onboard in any way and I'm all for converting sheets to PDFs for all the public
We do need more uploaders, though... the more updates the public sees, the more they will be happy to find their favorite music.

Anyone just let me know what you need me to do (im kinda good with computers, so i can do a bunch of converting to PDFs if it need be)

Right now, we're good with the sheets that you've been making lately :) Keep up the good work.

Otherwise, the future of NSM seems very bright now. :D The chat is insanely full, activity's on the high, it's great :D

I know, right?  ;D ... and thanks!  ;D

Just let me know if the PDF thing goes forward, I can help there!

Does anyone need any help with things like updating, converting, etc.? Because although I usually have a lot of spare time anyway, I have the next few weeks off making it even easier for me to be around and help out.

Converting is the main thing. Updating all the sheets is the only thing that we can really do. Since updating is something the mods won't let us do.

I've personally tried since I started here a year and a half ago.

There's no use in converting sheets if they aren't proper.
We should focus on fixing the sheets (cause to be honest, some of them really really suck) first and then start arranging and converting again.
Just my opinion.

^ agree

Quote from: Concerto No.20 in D minor on June 06, 2010, 01:39:15 AMOkay everybody.  In 3 weeks...THREE weeks, there is going to be a major project for NSM; and I'll need everyone's help.  I'll let you know more in 2 weeks.  : D

Okay, now there has been TWO MONTHS and four days.

Why not tell us straight away? At least, that will bring forth some motivation to actually finish this.

...maybe thats why Concerto is so inundated at the moment. I also have the feeling Nakah has his mind somewhere else, too (in terms of what Concerto is working on)

He's working on finishing the video for the Banjo project but there are still a few people that have not given him videos.  He's only giving them until the end of the week or so.

Banjo Project?

Community video project.

AKA a similar take to what Deku and Grim did with Majora's Mask, but BK music and by more people. and some other stuff he hasn't mentioned I believe.

Exciting.

ahh... like on the front page of their apollomix.

seems pretty cool! is he doing a site redesign or something?

Quote from: drpamplemousse on August 11, 2010, 12:39:25 PMahh... like on the front page of their apollomix.

Actually this was done while they were still at NSM, they just put it up at Apollo when they made the site.

oh i see.

I cant wait to see it!

I'm also doing another project that will need community help.  A LOT of community help.

Ill help... in NEARLY any way, shape or form

Quote from: Concerto No.20 in D minor on August 11, 2010, 04:45:58 PMI'm also doing another project that will need community help.  A LOT of community help.

It'd be a whole lot better if you announce what it is now. Unless it's like a "Oh, we see why you didn't announce it back then" sorta thing...

The TWG add on might draw new members to the forum..... even though this is only my fourth post (:-X), I've been on this site for quite a while.... The only thing I've really done is report a couple bugs and say my opinion on award motivation. However, I have to say that it really DOES draw more members to the forum, because the announcement on TWG brought me back to the forums for a fourth post. :D I'm currently reading through some of the earlier ones, it's very dramatic! Once I get past some schoolwork and I read through all the past ones for ideas, I'll probably decide to join a game. ;D Seeing as Nakah does most of the times by EST, the time suggestions would fit my schedule. See you there!

At least your small amount of participation is useful, not just a single intro post plus two or three posts in off topic then leaving.

Alright don't get me wrong I may have only posted 5 or so times on this forum, but I have been using this site for sheet music for an extremely long time. I couldn't help but notice all of the small problems on this site, and i sincerely wish i had more power to fix these things than just typing it up and hoping to god someone reads it and it get's back to someone with the power to fix the problem. I think this site has more potential than any other I've seen in a while (not to mention supporters). There's just a certain amount of organization that needs to be implemented. I don't want to be looked at as that guy who points out every little flaw in something already beautiful, but to be honest, it needs to be done.

You say you are looking for somebody with the skills and/or capability to do "all the coding you want"? Well you found him...or vice versa. I also have quite a bit of experience in graphic design which might be important because everyone is talking about "change".

I'm more than willing to spend about 3 hours out of each afternoon helping out with the site in many different ways. Although as I've noticed..... That is not going to happen..