This could be a general thread for instrumentation recognition "issues" so feel free to stick it if you think it's proper.
Either way, I'm posting it because I need some help. I know it's probably not crucial to recognize all the instruments in a piece to make a piano arrangement but my approach is to transcribe all the instrument parts seperately anyways and I think it's a good practice. So, anyways, I want some help with this piece:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt4EtG0Q40M
- So in the beginning at least there's some kind of drum being played offbeat. Any idea what kind of drum this might be?
- At 00:04 and 00:08 the last beat (in 3/4 time) seems to be accented with some kind of string instrument/s, possibly played pizzicato or played as staccato with bow. My guess is that it's a viola but could be wrong.
- At 00:09 a melody part starts. My guess is that it's some kind of mallet instrument playing. My guess is that it's a vibraphone. I don't think it's a xylophone or marimba because the decay on these is shorter.
- At 00:23 onwards, is it still one guitar playing or does a second guitar appear?
- At 00:45 there's a woodwind instrument playing the part. The question is which one. It seems to be too low for a flute and possibly too low for an oboe too. So a clarinet seems about right? Also, is it a triangle being played?
- At 00:54 there's another woodwind playing. Which one?
- At 01:02 there seems to be a mallet instrument playing. The same as before or is it maybe another one? Also there seem to be singing voices a few seconds later. I think I can hear tenor and alto voices.
- At 01:40 it seems to be a piano played with pedal. Right?
Anyways, that's it for now, I know it's detailed but help with whatever you can/want.
This could be fun:)
Quote- So in the beginning at least there's some kind of drum being played offbeat. Any idea what kind of drum this might be?
I am no percussionist, but I guess it could either be a bongo, or some kinda woodblock.
Quote- At 00:04 and 00:08 the last beat (in 3/4 time) seems to be accented with some kind of string instrument/s, possibly played pizzicato or played as staccato with bow. My guess is that it's a viola but could be wrong.
That is a bigger string ensemble doing a pizzicato on the same note.
Quote- At 00:09 a melody part starts. My guess is that it's some kind of mallet instrument playing. My guess is that it's a vibraphone. I don't think it's a xylophone or marimba because the decay on these is shorter.
I believe that is marimba. Vibraphone doesn't sound like that.
Quote- At 00:23 onwards, is it still one guitar playing or does a second guitar appear?
I'm pretty sure it still only is one guitar. (But for all we know there could be like four guitars.)
Quote- At 00:45 there's a woodwind instrument playing the part. The question is which one. It seems to be too low for a flute and possibly too low for an oboe too. So a clarinet seems about right? Also, is it a triangle being played?
That is an oboe! However, if you are arranging this, and you find out that that part is going below middle C, then you know it's not an oboe anymore - if so, then it's a cor anglais. And yes, there is a triangle being played.
Quote- At 00:54 there's another woodwind playing. Which one?
The instrument that joins is a clarinet.
Quote- At 01:02 there seems to be a mallet instrument playing. The same as before or is it maybe another one? Also there seem to be singing voices a few seconds later. I think I can hear tenor and alto voices.
The mallet instrument is not the same. This time it is a glockenspiel. And there are some weird synth voices in the background.
Quote- At 01:40 it seems to be a piano played with pedal. Right?
I don't see why there is pedal here, but there is this weird effect going on - not pedal, though.
Alright, thank you for clearing that up. :)
Ok, I'm having some trouble at 0:27 and 0:32. At 0:27 are there so kind of harmonic intervals played with the marimba (I'm referring to the two quarter notes played on the same pitch). The previous phrase with the marimba has eight notes at D, C# and then two quarter notes at E lower. This one seems to be the same but with something added below (E played in octaves?). At 0:32 I hear it's a marimba roll but I have trouble figuring out what kind of roll that is. The first marimba phrase which is similar to this one, except the roll, ends on a long C# note.
At 0:27 the harmonics go D with a B under, C with an A under, and then the two E with B under (this is called parallel fourths and is a quite recognizable effect). The chords in this measure go Bm to E9.
The marimba roll is just C# and B.
At 0:54 when the clarinet comes in, does it play in unison with the oboe? I've notated it and listened to it in Sibelius (using the 30 day trial atm) and I'm pretty sure that the unison playing is the only that makes sense. A confirmation would be nice. Also at 1:10 (at the first beat of the bar) there's a wierd sound made with either triangle (more probable I think) or glockenspiel. Any idea what it could be?
That is not unison. Unison means that they enharmonically play the same thing, both rhythmically and tonally. And they aren't playing the same tones at all, the clarinet is playing harmonies under the oboe.
And that weird sound is some kinda percussion. I don't know what, and it is hard to identify, but could it be something like this (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75726060/sorta%20like%20this%20right%3F.mus)?
Quote from: Jompa on June 04, 2013, 02:07:33 PMThat is not unison. Unison means that they enharmonically play the same thing, both rhythmically and tonally. And they aren't playing the same tones at all, the clarinet is playing harmonies under the oboe.
Ah you're right. I even notated that oboe phrase even before I started notating the clarinet phrase and before I wondered how the interaction between the clarinet and oboe looked. I somehow missed it/didn't think about it. Either way the phrase starts on D in the oboe part and B in the clarinet part so indeed the clarinet is playing harmonies below. The rhythm in that phrase seems to be the same or almost the same for the oboe and it seems like they are moving in parallell thirds for the most part in that phrase.
Quote from: Jompa on June 04, 2013, 02:07:33 PMAnd that weird sound is some kinda percussion. I don't know what, and it is hard to identify, but could it be something like this (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/75726060/sorta%20like%20this%20right%3F.mus)?
Yes, something like that. With percussion instruments (at least the indefinitely pitched ones) there are really many options.
I have trouble figuring out the guitar note (if there is one) at 0:13 when the pizzicato strings play F# (on the last beat of the bar). Edit: Marimba plays D E (eight notes).
It is an F# - the same note as the pizzicato strings.
Quote from: Jompa on June 10, 2013, 09:19:54 AMIt is an F# - the same note as the pizzicato strings.
Alright, thanks!
At 0:27 (the first beat of the bar) there is a kind of bright percussion sound. Any idea what it could be (first and foremost I want to be sure it's not a glockenspiel and if it is I want to know what is played because I honestly have no idea)?
A tambourine, perhaps
I'm not done with that piece yet (it takes very long but it's a good practice, maybe things will go quicker with the one I will arrange) but I've decided that I will try to get into this piece (Demon's Souls- The One Who Craves Souls): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ESqvGzdnvs
So once again I wonder about the instruments. This time it's way easier I think. So here's what I think (correct me if I'm wrong):
- In the beginning you can hear a piano, timpani and probably either two violin parts or one violin and a viola. Does this seem correct or am I missing something?
- At 0:46 (after the climax) there seem to be two string instruments: A clear violin melody and something else underneath, another violin part or viola maybe?
- At 1:00 when the timpani returns is it a violin or viola? And also, is there another string instrument playing?
- At 1:07 it seems like the violin is playing the melody and maybe a viola playing the more rhythmic part?
- 2:00, a single viola part or does it seem to be more parts (except the obvious piano ofc)?
Some parts are later repeated but overall does this seem correct?
Beginning - you're mostly right, but in addition to the two violins, there is also a cello underneath everything--listen closely.
1:00 - it's two violins.
1:07 - two violins and one viola--one violin playing melody, the other violin and viola playing the rhythmic bass melody. The cello is still there, also playing the rhythmic sections.
2:00 - still two violins, one playing harmony notes below the other one.
I'm not at home for the weekend, but I'll help later:)
Slow's right.
Lets try this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO7OiXpMLL8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO7OiXpMLL8)
I don't need to know what the instruments are per say, but how many are playing at any given time.
Thanks!
Alright, thanks guys. So it's basically a string quartet (but maybe with more than one player in each part so more like a string orchestra without double basses) plus piano and timpani.
Quote from: FireArrow on June 23, 2013, 09:37:41 AMLets try this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO7OiXpMLL8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO7OiXpMLL8)
I don't need to know what the instruments are per say, but how many are playing at any given time.
Thanks!
I would be able to help some but I'm not sure why it's important for you to know how many instruments are playing at a given time and what exactly you mean by that. Do you mean like if it's lets say one oboe or two oboes playing the same part or if lets say 5 different instruments (or parts) are being played at the same time? Basically, make things clearer.
Either way, I want to double check (if I have guessed things correctly) this one:
- So in the beginning there's just the piano playing.
- At 0:20 the male voices enter (bass and tenor).
- At 0:39 the female voices enter (alto and soprano) forming a full SATB.
- At 0:57 it's a flute.
- At 1:35 the flute stops playing and the voices (SATB) re-enter.
Ofc the piano is playing throughout the whole piece.
Edit: at 0:57 the part has both flute and clarinet it seems.
Edit 2: It's the clarinet that enters. Is there even a flute there or is the sound of the high clarinet so much different from the low clarinet sound? I'm confused.
Quote from: Ricky on July 01, 2013, 10:47:13 AMI would be able to help some but I'm not sure why it's important for you to know how many instruments are playing at a given time and what exactly you mean by that. Do you mean like if it's lets say one oboe or two oboes playing the same part or if lets say 5 different instruments (or parts) are being played at the same time? Basically, make things clearer.
The 5 instruments and what they are and when they play (ironically, this song as 5 tracks.) The reason is because I'm trying to transcribe every voice, but according to olimar I'm still missing some, so if I know what instrument to look for, then I should be able to hear it.
~Sorry for being vague.
Quote from: FireArrow on July 01, 2013, 11:11:30 AMThe 5 instruments and what they are and when they play (ironically, this song as 5 tracks.) The reason is because I'm trying to transcribe every voice, but according to olimar I'm still missing some, so if I know what instrument to look for, then I should be able to hear it.
~Sorry for being vague.
Ah ok, so there are only max 5 instruments playing at the same time in this piece (quite a coincidence I said 5 then)? I will try to help later.
Quote from: Ricky on July 01, 2013, 11:20:43 AMAh ok, so there are only max 5 instruments playing at the same time in this piece (quite a coincidence I said 5 then)? I will try to help later.
I'm gonna try to help you (take this with a grain of salt.)
I play the flute, and I really don't hear one at all in that, I think it's just a clarinet (some reed instrument.)
Ricky's piece "Greede the Capital of Freedom" from White Knight Chronicles Ancient Heartbeat
0:00 - Piano
0:20 - Two male voices, bass and tenor
0:39 - Two female voices, alto and soprano
- In addition, what sounds like a low timpani (or perhaps bass drum?) appears here. It does not play very often, only playing again at 0:48. Not sure if you're ignoring it because it's such a minor part (I think I'd probably omit it) or just didn't hear it.
0:57 - Clarinet enters--there is no flute in this piece.
1:35 - Repeats back to 0:39, with all four voices singing and that percussive instrument playing that one beat again.
i feel smart now
Quote from: SlowPokemon on July 01, 2013, 11:27:56 AMIn addition, what sounds like a low timpani (or perhaps bass drum?) appears here. It does not play very often, only playing again at 0:48. Not sure if you're ignoring it because it's such a minor part (I think I'd probably omit it) or just didn't hear it.
I didn't hear it. Anyways, thanks!
@FireArrow, thanks! Now here's my attempt to help you (I might be quite wrong but it's a good practice to try):
- In general the sounds seem to be quite synthy I believe but either way in the beginning we have a xylophone (?) & synthy instrument playing the melody in unison (?), an organ (or something like that, it sounds very synthy) (?), bass guitar (entering a few seconds after it begins or maybe even directly), snare drum entering at 0:02.
- At around 0:04 (except for a wierd synthy effect that starts that part, edit: in fact it's there from the start, it's the thing doing the crescendo) there's still a bass guitar, xylophone & synth, the synthy organ (?) playing some harmonies and answering the xylophone, now we also have a drumset. And I think it's about the same instrumentation till about 0:11.
- At around 0:11 we have a trumpet, bass guitar, xylophone, tuba (? or maybe just the bass guitar dunno), drum kit, possibly still the organ or some other instrument playing a "whiny" (it sounds like that to me) part.
- At around 0:15 we have the xylophone, snare drum, organ, drum kit, bass guitar. The snare drum becomes more clear in a few seconds.
- At around 0:18 we have bass guitar, the wierd synthy effect which appeared in the beginning, snare drum, drum kit, the synth (or whatever it is) playing the melody, organ or some other instrument playing higher notes (?).
- At around 0:26 we have a bass guitar, xylophone, synth, drum kit and organ.
- At around 0:30 we have xylophone, bass guitar, drum kit, organ and the synth (?).
- At around 0:34 we have a clear snare drum, organ, bass guitar, xylophone and synth plus possibly some other instrument doing that wierd thing at 0:36.
- At around 0:40 we have the xylophone, snare drum, some wierd synth effect, organ & bass guitar.
- At around 0:46 we have a bass guitar, organ, bass drum, the wierd synth sound that I've mentioned in the beginning, some kind of percussive instrument playing at the same time as the organ.
- At around 0:54 we have organ, snare drum, synth playing the melody (now when I think about it, it kinda sounds like a trumpet).
- At around 0:58 it's the synthy trumpet or whatever, xylophone, organ, snare drum (more specifically at 1:01 there is another instrument playing a very short part) and the bass guitar seems to be playing repeated notes.
- At around 1:02 the wierd synth effect that was in the beginning enters, the bass guitar is alot clearer now, xylophone, synth, snare drum.
And the second half is a repetition of the first half?
Anyways, that was my (messy) attempt to help.
Woah, thanks a ton! I don't think I'm hearing everything you are, but hopefully it'll come around. Thanks again.
Quote from: FireArrow on July 01, 2013, 03:39:46 PMWoah, thanks a ton! I don't think I'm hearing everything you are, but hopefully it'll come around. Thanks again.
Have you tried using headphones?
Quote from: Ricky on July 01, 2013, 10:36:00 PMHave you tried using headphones?
Yeah, ever since olimar told me too. It makes a huge difference, but my ears are still not that great.
Quote from: FireArrow on July 01, 2013, 10:40:51 PMYeah, ever since olimar told me too. It makes a huge difference, but my ears are still not that great.
What I did basically was listen to the different parts of the piece several times and write down the different instruments (which might be incorrect) that I've heard gradually. Then I was checking if it was right or if I missed something etc. A good idea is to think high, low and middle.
But on the other hand I've done much practice at instrument recognition recently by checking out videos about different instruments on Youtube and also by score reading (which I'm really bad at but already much better than I was, in some cases it was more of just active listening and trying to follow what happens (without much notice of the actual pitches and harmonies etc.)) so don't worry, you will get (much) better with practice.
In "Greede the Capital of Freedom" I have trouble figuring out the voice parts (especially as the voice lines seem so fluid) so I need some help. For now I will just ask one question to feel more certain: At about 0:20 the tenor and bass part starts. My question/s is/are if the tenor starts the part with singing an F below middle C and if the bass comes in on the second beat and sings a C below middle C?
Some info that might be useful: It seems like the piece is in 4/4. The key signature has 3 flats (Bb, Eb & Ab) in the start and a Db appears later on. The piece starts on F which seems to be its' tonic which means the piece at least in the start is in F Dorian (whether the Db is to be interpreted as some kind of modulation or if it's a switch to the parallell aeolian is something I haven't figured out yet).
There are only three voices from what I can tell. You can have the bass and the tenor parts labeled as Baritone or something like that. As far as I know, there are only three.
I hope this answers your question.
Quote from: Brassman388 on July 19, 2013, 05:45:59 PMThere are only three voices from what I can tell. You can have the bass and the tenor parts labeled as Baritone or something like that. As far as I know, there are only three.
I hope this answers your question.
That would make things easier.
Can anyone here confirm this?
Old Gregorian Chants didn't use the SATB notation. They used an entire different notation all together. However, for our purposes I'm saying use Soprano, Alto, and Baritone. I believe a Baritone can hit a low A in the Bass Clef range and a Low D in the Treble Clef range.
This should accomplish what you want.
Quote from: Brassman388 on July 20, 2013, 01:30:18 PMOld Gregorian Chants didn't use the SATB notation. They used an entire different notation all together. However, for our purposes I'm saying use Soprano, Alto, and Baritone. I believe a Baritone can hit a low A in the Bass Clef range and a Low D in the Treble Clef range.
This should accomplish what you want.
I don't see how this can be compared to an old gregorian chant. Gregorian chants are monophonic, this obviously isn't. Do you refer to medieval music in general or so? Then it might be truer (although women's voices weren't used at first at least).
The style of the piece is what I'm talking about. My goodness, everyone has to be so specific.
Anyways, that's my advice.
So, back to Greede, at 2:07 to 2:10 for example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9tTSx5SI6A) isn't it tenor voices over the bass voice? To me it sounds like high male voices rather than low female voices.
I think they ound like low female voices.
Alright, thanks!