[SWITCH] Kirby Star Allies - "Kindness-Steeping Street" by Radiak488417

Started by Zeta, January 15, 2021, 03:00:14 PM

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Zeta

Submission Information:

Series: Kirby
Game: Kirby Star Allies
Console: Nintendo Switch
Title: Kindness-Steeping Street
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: Radiak488417

[attachment deleted by admin]

Radiak488417


Been sitting on this one for quite a while, glad to finally submit it  :)

Stuff:

- Pedals need to be added back in
- I'm unsure about some of the cross-staving
- The key changes were the best I could come up with, so if other people have ideas I'd be happy to hear them

LeviR.star

Oh thank God, someone actually did this one!

And did it well, too! Awesome work, Radiak!
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

Zeila

Before getting into this, should we stick with the VGMDB translated titles or the ones used by YouTuber Eternal (found here)? If the latter, this one would be called Street Paved with Kindness. This totally isn't because I like some of the other translated titles better like Playfully Crushing Stars vs Star-Destroying Playing, Sorrowful Wings of the Heavens vs Wing of Sorrow and All Heavens, and Cowering Officiant of God vs Priest Bowing in Holy Worship

General
  • I think there could be more dynamic contrast. For example, measures 9-16 sound like they could be at mf or at least louder than m1-8 and m17-20, measures 7-8 sound softer than m1-6, m15-16 could use a diminuendo, measures 21-22 could use a crescendo to make m23 forte, and maybe some other spots could use some changing too. These are just rough suggestions
  • I don't understand why some places use a dotted quarter while others use quarter + eighth rest (e.g. measure 3 vs measures 5, 23, and 27)
  • Continuing with that, I don't understand why measures 14 and 24 have any rests instead of using a half note or quarter note respectively
  • Why is the second layer in m12 a quarter note while the one in m16 is a whole note

Notes
  • m5 RH beat 1 missing D in the middle; idk if you intentionally omitted it because of the interval but you could put a roll marking for the RH (or just leave it out)
  • m7 RH beat 1 I don't hear a D here
  • m16 RH beat 1 missing Bb on top; I think there might be a G below the low Bb too. If you don't want to add more 10ths then that's okay
  • m17 LH beat 3.5 F should be a quarter note and replace the following Bb too
  • m18 LH upper C might not be part of the chord? I'm not sure
  • m23 LH beat 2 you could either cross staff this note or notate that the RH should play it
  • m27 It would be better to move the bottom Cb on beat 1 and the following Gb and Bb to the LH since it wasn't doing anything before
  • m28 RH beat 1 Bb should be lowered by an octave
  • m31 RH beat 1 I think there might be an Ab here but it's understandable if you want to omit it regardless
  • m33 RH beat 2.5 I don't hear the upper A, beat 3.5 D would be better put in the LH; LH last G should be up an octave

Since I did some formatting changes for you, I did everything else already except for a few notes I weren't sure on and parts that require your own input/interpretation

[MUS]

Dekkadeci

Honestly, I find both sets of titles hard to completely trust - VGMDB missed a crucial word in 6-08's Japanese title, causing its translation to be wrong, while Eternal's translations of titles like 5-18 are definitely less faithful. (Both end up similarly playing loose with translations like 6-01, although HAL Laboratory's translations for the Kirby: Planet Robobot OST might be the loosest of all in places.)

Radiak488417

Thanks for all this! My thoughts:

For the title, I'm honestly not sure what the best call is. I think Eternal's translation is maybe better-sounding, but it's a bit less faithful to the original title than the VGMdb one (染まる means to dye something, not pave it). At the end of the day there just isn't an official English translation for the OST, so maybe we should take a vote on which set of names to use so we can have a consistent titling scheme for any future Star Allies sheets (I don't have a particularly strong preference either way).

General:

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • I think there could be more dynamic contrast. For example, measures 9-16 sound like they could be at mf or at least louder than m1-8 and m17-20, measures 7-8 sound softer than m1-6, m15-16 could use a diminuendo, measures 21-22 could use a crescendo to make m23 forte, and maybe some other spots could use some changing too. These are just rough suggestions
I was having trouble deciding what dynamics to add, so I decided to wait until submissions to ask about them (which I forgot to do, whoops). I've added some based on your suggestions, let me know if you think I could add more.

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • I don't understand why some places use a dotted quarter while others use quarter + eighth rest (e.g. measure 3 vs measures 5, 23, and 27)
  • Continuing with that, I don't understand why measures 14 and 24 have any rests instead of using a half note or quarter note respectively
Somehow didn't see these, changed them all to be full duration (as well as m17 LH and m24 RH).

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • Why is the second layer in m12 a quarter note while the one in m16 is a whole note
I think the original reason was that the LH in m16 has to keep holding the note after the pedal pickup, whereas in m12 the pedal can just carry the note. I think it makes sense to have them both be whole notes, though.

It also looks like you changed the dyad on beat 2.5 in m12 to have the top note held longer, which I didn't see you mention. I agree with this, but you also deleted the arpeggio, which I think should still be there.

Notes:

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • m5 RH beat 1 missing D in the middle; idk if you intentionally omitted it because of the interval but you could put a roll marking for the RH (or just leave it out)
I actually just didn't hear this one, nice catch. I'm not sure if I want to include it though, that's a pretty tough roll.

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • m16 RH beat 1 missing Bb on top; I think there might be a G below the low Bb too. If you don't want to add more 10ths then that's okay
I honestly can't hear either of these notes using Audiostretch, so if someone else could check them out I'd appreciate it (I've removed the Bb for now).

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • m18 LH upper C might not be part of the chord? I'm not sure
Yeah, I don't think it is. Removed it.

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • m23 LH beat 2 you could either cross staff this note or notate that the RH should play it
I unfortunately can't do either of these things with NotePad, but I think having it be in the LH makes it more clear that it isn't part of the melody anyway (m2 has the same note). If I had to pick, though, I'd prefer to cross staff it.

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AM
  • m31 RH beat 1 I think there might be an Ab here but it's understandable if you want to omit it regardless
Yeah I can't really hear it, and even if I could it's probably faint enough that I wouldn't want to include it.

Some other things:

- I think the high A in m11 might be an overtone, but I'm not sure
- I forgot to put the D.C in Times New Roman, so if someone could fix that I'd appreciate it

Everything else looks great, thanks again for all the feedback!

Latios212

Checking time :)

- I think I had mentioned this to you when we were chatting individually, but I don't think the pedal lines here add much value. It's almost always just reset every measure - and the few places it isn't can be clarified by use of extended notes vs. rests.
- Last RH E in m. 2 should be an octave up
- I don't hear the Eb restruck in the RH chord of m. 25 (beat 3.5)
- Would suggest connecting the beams in m. 11 for cross-staffed beats 3-4
- A few stems are flipped or would be better off flipped - places include m. 14 beat 3.5 LH, m. 21/22 LH beat 1, m. 32 RH beat 1.5

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AMm5 RH beat 1 missing D in the middle; idk if you intentionally omitted it because of the interval but you could put a roll marking for the RH (or just leave it out)
Quote from: Radiak488417 on January 25, 2021, 07:51:23 PMI actually just didn't hear this one, nice catch. I'm not sure if I want to include it though, that's a pretty tough roll.
Agreed with leaving it out

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AMm16 RH beat 1 missing Bb on top; I think there might be a G below the low Bb too. If you don't want to add more 10ths then that's okay
Quote from: Radiak488417 on January 25, 2021, 07:51:23 PMI honestly can't hear either of these notes using Audiostretch, so if someone else could check them out I'd appreciate it (I've removed the Bb for now).
I hear this as in Radiak's sheet right now (so without these extra notes?)

Quote from: Zeila on January 20, 2021, 05:28:24 AMm23 LH beat 2 you could either cross staff this note or notate that the RH should play it
Quote from: Radiak488417 on January 25, 2021, 07:51:23 PMI unfortunately can't do either of these things with NotePad, but I think having it be in the LH makes it more clear that it isn't part of the melody anyway (m2 has the same note). If I had to pick, though, I'd prefer to cross staff it.
I disagree with cross-staffing it. It's just a G and throwing it on the top staff would make it look rather strange

Quote from: Radiak488417 on January 25, 2021, 07:51:23 PMSome other things:

- I think the high A in m11 might be an overtone, but I'm not sure
It's faint but I think it's fine as you wrote it.

One more thing - really not convinced by those key changes oh page 2. This piece kind of... slides all over the place so I'll probably end up asking for someone else's opinion on that.

As usual, I can help out with the formatting and stuff later. I'll give the cross-staffing and smaller visual details a closer look when I do that.

also that video you linked has good audio quality but made me jump at 2:35 lol
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

Radiak488417

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PMI think I had mentioned this to you when we were chatting individually, but I don't think the pedal lines here add much value. It's almost always just reset every measure - and the few places it isn't can be clarified by use of extended notes vs. rests.
Ah yeah I forgot about that, if you could hide the pedals and add a con pedale that'd be great.

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PMLast RH E in m. 2 should be an octave up
I can sort of hear that higher note, but I think it might just be an overtone or something. I'd prefer to keep it as is for the sake of melodic clarity.

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PM- I don't hear the Eb restruck in the RH chord of m. 25 (beat 3.5)
Right you are, deleted it.

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PMWould suggest connecting the beams in m. 11 for cross-staffed beats 3-4
The way I implemented the cross-staving here doesn't allow for that, since all three notes are all technically part of the top staff and can't be beamed to any in the bottom staff. If you or someone else could beam these for me, I'd appreciate it.

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PM-A few stems are flipped or would be better off flipped - places include m. 14 beat 3.5 LH, m. 21/22 LH beat 1, m. 32 RH beat 1.5
Got 'em

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PMOne more thing - really not convinced by those key changes oh page 2. This piece kind of... slides all over the place so I'll probably end up asking for someone else's opinion on that.
Yeah, I wasn't too convinced by them myself haha. I swear I'm not picking all these weird songs on purpose... maybe I just like wacky modulations?  :P

Quote from: Latios212 on February 11, 2021, 05:44:22 PMalso that video you linked has good audio quality but made me jump at 2:35 lol
Wow, I never listened that far, that's unfortunate lol.

Latios212

Cool... I went ahead and gave this a formatting/polish pass. Mostly adjust some staff spacing, correct text styles, and aligned dynamics. Also changed the cross-staffing in m. 11 mentioned above. I also think the F in m. 15 would be better not cross-staffed and reverted it, but let me know if you disagree.

If this all looks good to you, then I think that's it from me and we'll have someone else look over the keysigs.
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

Radiak488417

Looks great, m15 included. A few final things:

-I think a roll could maybe work better for m5, let me know what you think.
-m11 I think the C on beat 3.5 would be better off in the LH.
-m28 RH beat 1 Bb could maybe be in the LH? I find it easier to play that way.
-Beat 1 of m29 should be rolled.

Latios212

I think m. 5 is good as is - those A's definitely play before the other notes. Agreed with the other three points and updated the files.

Will approve now, given someone else (Static?) reviews the key signatures.
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

Static

Wow this is great. Finally we have a Star Allies sub lol
  • So when you have a rolled chord in both hands, it's actually more common to write that with one long arpeggio marking instead of 2 separate ones. So for m18-19, you'd just hide one of them and drag the other down so it stretches across both staves.
  • As for the key changes, yes the piece does clearly modulate to different keys, but since it modulates so frequently towards the end, I think it would be better to write it all in F. You might want to consider rewriting m25-32 in F# also, since the Db7/C#7 acts as a resolution to D in m33; up to you though.
The rest looks good

Radiak488417

Can't do any of these things with Notepad, but I agree with all of them, and I think m13 could use an extended roll marking along with m18-19. Also for m25-32, did you mean change the keysig to F# or just write it with accidentals?

Static

Quote from: Radiak488417 on March 16, 2021, 02:04:08 PMAlso for m25-32, did you mean change the keysig to F# or just write it with accidentals?
Yes, just write it with accidentals

Also sorry I forgot you use notepad, here's the files with those things changed

Static

Discussed a bit over Discord, we decided to change the F# section back to Gb, which ultimately is easier to read in this context even despite the Dmaj shift in m33. I'll be accepting this one now