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[MUL] Yoshi's Cookie - "1P Music Type A" (Replacement) by LeviR.star

Started by Zeta, May 01, 2022, 04:16:45 PM

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Zeta

Submission Information:

Series: Super Mario
Game: Yoshi's Cookie
Console: Multiplatform
Title: 1P Music Type A
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: LeviR.star


Replacement Information:

Links to Existing Sheet: MUS | MIDI | PDF
Replacement Type: Challenge (new arranger)

[attachment deleted by admin]

LeviR.star




Some things we need to figure out:

- rest placement, because we've got ourselves two layers in the right hand again
- how to divide up the sheets on the site. I'm guessing this game is similar to Wario's Woods in that the NES and SNES versions have some shared tracks, as well as some exclusives on their respective consoles. This track in particular is not much different from its SNES counterpart, but from what I've heard of the other SNES remixes, this is no trend, and a separate section on the site would eventually be necessary (we can't stick with [MUL]). I haven't listened to the rest of the on-site sheets, but I'm guessing they're all based on the NES version
- the title. I want to assume "Music A" is fine, but this is a Bullet-Proof Software game, the same developer that ported Tetris to the Game Boy. For the sheets of that game we're hosting, the tracks are labeled "A, B, C Theme", and in both games, the menu describes the tracks as "music types"
- who developed this game, anyway? I've got one source that says the NES/GB releases (which I assume are near-identical) were developed by Tose, and that the SNES port was done by Bullet-Proof Software, but this doesn't seem right. The latter developer is included on the former version's title screen, and one of our more recent Yoshi's Cookie sheets credits Blue Planet Software, which I've only seen associated with the SNES release. Help!
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

XiaoMigros

Quote from: LeviR.star on May 01, 2022, 08:48:55 PM- rest placement
This needs some work for sure, I think in general they can be much closer to the center of the staff. For this sheet it would make sense to keep rests in the same layer at the same height in each measure. In general, I'd try to avoid "floating" rests (ones that don't touch any staff lines), but that may get a bit to close to the other layer at times.

Two more small things:
  • Is it possible to fit one more measure into the first system? That would align the rest of the sheet more nicely and get rid of that lone measure in the last system.
  • Perhaps it's worth still writing the two layers separately in ms. 16 and 24, since you have them written separately in all other measures.

Static

  • My suggestion is to title this [MUL] "1P Music Type A", based on this information:
    • the NES and GB OSTs sound pretty much identical, so I think keeping it MUL is fine. The SNES game would then get it's own section, so MUL and SNES. I think that works.
    • The current sheets for the C themes are titled "1/2P Music Type C", which seems to correspond with the game as you mentioned (although 2P should really be changed to VS then to match the game). So I guess I'd suggest going with those. Your sheet is of the 1P A theme btw.
    • Regarding the copyright, go with the game itself - that's guaranteed to be correct (well, hopefully). So, Nintendo and Bullet-Proof Software it looks like.
    • The Tetris titles can be edited later to match this
  • The A on beat 3 of m32 I think is meant to be part of the background voice - it's more subdued like the F# underneath it. The melody starts right on beat 4, just like the pickup at the beginning.

Latios212

Quote from: LeviR.star on May 01, 2022, 08:48:55 PM- rest placement, because we've got ourselves two layers in the right hand again
Quote from: XiaoMigros on May 02, 2022, 01:53:58 AMThis needs some work for sure, I think in general they can be much closer to the center of the staff. For this sheet it would make sense to keep rests in the same layer at the same height in each measure. In general, I'd try to avoid "floating" rests (ones that don't touch any staff lines), but that may get a bit to close to the other layer at times.
In general, I suggest trying to keep the rests roughly on the same horizontal level as the rest of the rest of the layer. So while floating rests (as above, ones not touching the staff) work quite nicely in some cases where one layer's notes are all on ledger lines, it's a bit weird for pieces like this where the notes are generally on the staff. I'm not generally a fan of keeping rests partially on the staff, but here I think it would work best where they can't keep their normal position mid-staff. Try playing around with it a bit and see if you like that better; I think you will.

Quote from: LeviR.star on May 01, 2022, 08:48:55 PM- how to divide up the sheets on the site. I'm guessing this game is similar to Wario's Woods in that the NES and SNES versions have some shared tracks, as well as some exclusives on their respective consoles. This track in particular is not much different from its SNES counterpart, but from what I've heard of the other SNES remixes, this is no trend, and a separate section on the site would eventually be necessary (we can't stick with [MUL]). I haven't listened to the rest of the on-site sheets, but I'm guessing they're all based on the NES version
I'm not super familiar with the game, but yes based on what you described the SNES tracks should be placed in a separate listing. However... I think the original release may need to stay [MUL] because it was released simultaneously on NES and GB. Even though that might be a bit confusing when browsing :/

Quote from: LeviR.star on May 01, 2022, 08:48:55 PM- who developed this game, anyway? I've got one source that says the NES/GB releases (which I assume are near-identical) were developed by Tose, and that the SNES port was done by Bullet-Proof Software, but this doesn't seem right. The latter developer is included on the former version's title screen, and one of our more recent Yoshi's Cookie sheets credits Blue Planet Software, which I've only seen associated with the SNES release. Help!
According to Wikipedia, Tose developed it and thus should be listed. The NES title screen credits Bullet-Proof Software, so I think it makes sense to list that too. Blue Planet Software seems to be what the company became later on, so I don't think it should be included. So from what I can tell right now, it seems right to include Nintendo, Tose, and Bullet-Proof Software.
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

LeviR.star

Quote from: XiaoMigros on May 02, 2022, 01:53:58 AM
  • Is it possible to fit one more measure into the first system? That would align the rest of the sheet more nicely and get rid of that lone measure in the last system.
  • Perhaps it's worth still writing the two layers separately in ms. 16 and 24, since you have them written separately in all other measures.
Quote from: Static on May 04, 2022, 07:58:39 PM
  • My suggestion is to title this [MUL] "1P Music Type A", based on this information:
    • the NES and GB OSTs sound pretty much identical, so I think keeping it MUL is fine. The SNES game would then get it's own section, so MUL and SNES. I think that works.
    • The current sheets for the C themes are titled "1/2P Music Type C", which seems to correspond with the game as you mentioned (although 2P should really be changed to VS then to match the game). So I guess I'd suggest going with those. Your sheet is of the 1P A theme btw.
    • Regarding the copyright, go with the game itself - that's guaranteed to be correct (well, hopefully). So, Nintendo and Bullet-Proof Software it looks like.
    • The Tetris titles can be edited later to match this
  • The A on beat 3 of m32 I think is meant to be part of the background voice - it's more subdued like the F# underneath it. The melody starts right on beat 4, just like the pickup at the beginning.
Quote from: Latios212 on May 21, 2022, 04:21:54 PM- In general, I suggest trying to keep the rests roughly on the same horizontal level as the rest of the rest of the layer. So while floating rests (as above, ones not touching the staff) work quite nicely in some cases where one layer's notes are all on ledger lines, it's a bit weird for pieces like this where the notes are generally on the staff. I'm not generally a fan of keeping rests partially on the staff, but here I think it would work best where they can't keep their normal position mid-staff. Try playing around with it a bit and see if you like that better; I think you will.
- I'm not super familiar with the game, but yes based on what you described the SNES tracks should be placed in a separate listing. However... I think the original release may need to stay [MUL] because it was released simultaneously on NES and GB. Even though that might be a bit confusing when browsing :/
- According to Wikipedia, Tose developed it and thus should be listed. The NES title screen credits Bullet-Proof Software, so I think it makes sense to list that too. Blue Planet Software seems to be what the company became later on, so I don't think it should be included. So from what I can tell right now, it seems right to include Nintendo, Tose, and Bullet-Proof Software.

- sure, I can do that
- you make a good point, I'll fix that
- okay, I'll rename it on the files, but since this is a replacement, I still need your help updating the sheet's title on the submission itself
- what's wrong with the way I have it notated? It's transcribed accurately, and works fine within the two layers
- I don't like it when the rests touch the line, but what's proper is proper, and I'm not one to argue. There were a couple cases in which rests had to float away from the bottom staff line because spacing demanded it, but otherwise, most of them are touching. I am giving the updaters permission to move these rests where they see fit; in fact, I am encouraging it, maybe even requesting it
- I forgot there was a Game Boy version when I submitted this, so that's on me (pfft, some Game Boy fan I am...) The reason I think the SNES version would work best as a separate listing is that it wasn't developed at the same time as the NES/Game Boy versions, and released a whole year later
- I just remembered that Tose is a ghost developer that rarely credits itself, which is why we don't see it listed on the title screen. I'll go with those three listings, then

One more thing about naming schemes: I'm not sure if this is a viable reference, but the Super Smash Bros. series has called what we know as the "Tetris theme" "Type A" for the last three installements, and it was Hirokazu Tanaka of Nintendo that popularized "Korobeiniki" as the main theme of Tetris. If this isn't enough of a reason to re-name what we have on-site, then I'm not sure what else is.
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

Static

Quote from: LeviR.star on May 22, 2022, 08:14:24 PM- what's wrong with the way I have it notated? It's transcribed accurately, and works fine within the two layers
My bad, I was hearing the A as held for a half note for some reason, but it's not. What you have is correct! Approved

Got that title changed for you too

Edit: About the rests, honestly they seem OK to me in most places. I like the consistency of them appearing below/above the staff, I think it makes things easier to follow imo. So the only measure I might change is 27, where you can move the rests down. On the other hand, keeping rests aligned with the layer is nice too... I'll let the next updater decide, but generally I'm fine with the current layout.

Latios212

Before I go into checking all the pitches and rest positions (note to self: already verified the bassline), have you considered simply lowering the third voice an octave whenever it jumps above the melody like in m. 2-5? Aside from being visually cleaner, I tried it out briefly on my keyboard and it sounds a lot more natural that way while being a little easier to manage. Particularly with a "dry"-sounding piece like this, it can be hard to highlight the melody when the third voice jumps over it, so I would recommend keeping it on top. The offbeats also function primarily rhythmically here so I don't think it'd be a big deal to lower them.

Also, the thing I usually say about centering the staccatos around the noteheads instead of the stems?
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

LeviR.star

Quote from: Latios212 on May 31, 2022, 07:14:34 PMBefore I go into checking all the pitches and rest positions (note to self: already verified the bassline), have you considered simply lowering the third voice an octave whenever it jumps above the melody like in m. 2-5? Aside from being visually cleaner, I tried it out briefly on my keyboard and it sounds a lot more natural that way while being a little easier to manage. Particularly with a "dry"-sounding piece like this, it can be hard to highlight the melody when the third voice jumps over it, so I would recommend keeping it on top. The offbeats also function primarily rhythmically here so I don't think it'd be a big deal to lower them.

That's a good idea, and it works for a little while, until we hit the second page. Then I've got all of these octave jumps to accommodate overlapping voices, and it doesn't work nearly as well as before. What'll be the solution to this predicament on the second page? Link to PDF here
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

Latios212

Quote from: LeviR.star on June 08, 2022, 01:27:40 PMThat's a good idea, and it works for a little while, until we hit the second page. Then I've got all of these octave jumps to accommodate overlapping voices, and it doesn't work nearly as well as before. What'll be the solution to this predicament on the second page? Link to PDF here
Page 1 looks good, yep. For page 2 I would suggest simply having the noteheads overlap if they happen to be playing the same note. Specifically referring to m. 18/20/22 beat 4. I think having the noteheads overlap (and not be staccato) would sound fine and be natural to play, even if you lose the staccato offbeat sound. Alternatively, you could substitute them for another note that fits the chord. Thoughts on that? Everything else looks fine note-wise.

Also last couple of small things:
- Flip m. 10 beat 4 RH
Quote from: Latios212 on May 31, 2022, 07:14:34 PMAlso, the thing I usually say about centering the staccatos around the noteheads instead of the stems?
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

LeviR.star

Went over the changes with Latios over Discord, this puppy should be good to go, unless there's something else I missed.
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

Latios212

Yep, had a little discussion on swapping out a few of the awkward offbeat chord tones for others that match the chord, and confirmed the rest heights are all reasonable. I'll accept :)
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

Quote from: Dudeman on February 22, 2016, 10:16:37 AM
who needs education when you can have WAIFUS!!!!!

Spoiler
[close]
turtle

Zeta

This submission has been accepted by Latios212.

~Zeta, your friendly NSM-Bot