TWG LXXXI: Pokémon X & Y

[Brawler4Ever]

Brawler4Ever

Because he's been tunneling me all game with a suspicion that's complete nonsense.

Saw this coming from a mile away. Mashi.

Sooooo, it's up to Dude now? I doubt that Yugi will be coming back anytime due to technical difficulties. And if Dude doesn't vote, then the fate of the game is decided by a KITB. Dang this is intense! xD

I would find it pretty funny if Dude was the wolf after all. Just saying.

But on to more important matters...

I probably should have realised this before, but oh well.

Besides process of elimination, the only argument that you have that I am a wolf is the fact that I've been tunneling you? Is that correct? Because it would seem to me, either being the Wolf Seer or in league with the Wolf Seer, I would have taken a more active action against you. This, being under the assumption that you were Seered as a Special earlier. Why else would I, a wolf, be tunneling you specifically so much, as you said? I had the perfect opportunity to bring you down with very little risk during Day 3, with Olimar's lynching. It was 5v5 and was decided by a kitb. My vote would have tipped the favor against you, thus eliminating a player that I (as a wolf) would know to be human (or a Special, possibly). But I didn't. I chose to remain neutral. I would love to hear your theory as to why I would do that.

[Mashi]

There's no major evidence indicating that you're Human.  There's a bit of evidence supporting suspicion on you.  I decided to condone them because I felt you were Human by tone, the wagon developing on you Day 1, and your tunneling on me, but it's clear that I was wrong to do so now.

Throughout the game, you've never indicated a hint of wanting to find Wolves, only pushing lynches.  Your suspicion of NoctuenOfShadow stemmed off of you being too timid to declare your suspicion; you made it clear when chatting to me that you only thought that he was a Wolf, which could have easily been taken for given.  I figured such timidity would be expected from a new Player that was a Human, but the other potential possibility was a Wolf too timid to draw the spotlight.  When I was brought up a chat conversation you had with Dudeman, your only interest was "what to pin Mashi with" rather than a thorough analysis of whether you believed I was Human or Wolf.  When pressure developed on Olimar12345 and me Day 3, you placed a vote on Yugi and then only commented on believing Olimar12345 and me were Human, not bothering to push for a Yugi lynch, which would have been in line with your suspicions.

If you're a Wolf and both Olimar12345's wagon and my wagon were Human, it doesn't matter to you who dies.  In fact, a Wolf would rather keep me alive than Olimar12345 simply to push their suspicion on me, since more people were suspicious of me than of Olimar12345.  The fact that you decided to say you were starting to think I was Human that Phase only to do a 180 when convenient for you is in favor of suspicion against you, not evidence for your humanity.  In fact, if you were more suspicious of me than Olimar12345, the fact that you didn't vote for me is suspicious by most conventional TWG standards.

If I were a Wolf, I would have wolfed Jub3r7 a while ago since I thought he was Vigi (on that note, the Vigi was probably BlackDragonSlayer, by the way).  Here's a (very) messy log between Jub3r7 and I on Facebook.

I have to copy this off of Facebook and it has no names lol

Monday 12:21am
twg pls
Wednesday 2:52am
jerryyy
pls be active
and help me find the wolves
Wednesday 4:09pm

By the time phase ends I will absolutely have thoroughly analyzed each player that remains!

That includes you!
Wednesday 5:45pm
brawler4ever is suspicious of me for the dumbest reasoning
half of the stuff hes saying about me isnt even true
and then the other half is just confirmation bias
smh
i think the wolves are between yugi and maelstrom anyway
Wednesday 8:52pm

Why do you town read Dude?

And did you vigi dudeman or BlackDragonSlayer?

I remember you posting about townreading dude earlier with a reason, but I remember not agreeing

here are a lists of all the posts dude has made:

http://pastebin.com/dtZhry0a

I'm in the chat!
Wednesday 11:58pm
btw i'm like 99% sure youre the vigi lol
because im not dead yet

For srs?
ya
doesnt really matter tho tbh

actually it does because
pretty sure its between maelstrom and yugi

Yugi was last active on 7/14, but I guess he can't be the vigi?
I already checked, he could have made the wolfing/vigi since that was during the Night Phase.

because toby was gone
Oh wait
omg
lol
Good deduction, I completely forgot about Toby.

I thought about that just now

Anyway,

BDS might be the vigi. if not, then the vigi is still out there

Although maelstrom and B4e both have given non-vigi reads

here's the maelstrom post in question:

http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=7230.msg297274#msg297274
Hmm.
Yeah, I don't think maelstrom fits as vigi.
Maybe it was BlackDragonSlayer if it's not you.
"Or they didn't realize the night was so short."
oh whoops let me link the post
http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=7230.msg297275#msg297275Yeah
http://forum.ninsheetmusic.org/index.php?topic=7230.msg297275#msg297275
TWG LXXXI: Pokémon X & Y
TWG LXXXI: Pokémon X & Y
forum.ninsheetmusic.org
lol i accidentally added a yeah
Yeah, I think it was BlackDragonSlayer then.

bubbles was the guardian

or psychic
lol are you the seer
best seer

no you dont understand

all of my results 100% useless

they die

before i can even out that read
lol

or
Well, what we can do

roleblock

you could claim guardian or vigi
Yeah.
And see if someone counterclaims.

i seered you blue
omg hype

Or if you want to be extra safe

I seered you blue and you can claim psychic

(i didnt actually seer you blue)
Oh
lol

I was roleblocked before I could.

I seered firearrow, then he died

I seered bubbles, then she died

I seered you, then I was roleblocked
seer the wolves
then theyll die

is that how it works???
lol
Okay, how about this
Say you have a Red result on maelstrom or something
And then see how he reacts

sounds good
Oh oh oh
Do you want me to false claim in your place?

another strategy I had was to send out pm's to people assuming they were the vigi
And try to get myself wolfed?

That sounds good
Best case scenario: We're right about maelstrom and he's the last Wolf, so he gives up.

there's also the idea of sending maelstrom a message saying I think they're the vigi by process of elimination

and if they respond with yes??? then wow???

oh wait

I think he might know I'm the seer

since I was roleblocked

so false claiming in my place might not work

if he's the wolf

oh well, we have tomorrow

I heard kami was making you watch steven universe!!! (i dont know who that is but i recommend it as well)
You can be Herring or something.
And yeah, she's going to make me, haha.
Thursday 3:57pm
so
what are we doing about nsm twg

probably maelstrom

dude can vote maelstrom and if yugi is a wolf and comes back then we lose

OR

i can tell brawler4ever

the fact that you thought I was a vigi

Which wouldn't make sense if you were a wolf because I was roleblocked.

And the vigi succeeded.
Thursday 5:32pm
perf
and then hell say
clearly im so good
i would pretend to think you were the vigi
ill send doodle a message
yugis probs going to stay inactive

[close]

If I were a Wolf, there would be no reason for me to have made the wolfing choices that have occurred in general.  Why would I have wolfed people who believed I was Human rather than people suspicious of me?  You can't even use the reverse psychology argument there because I would win more often doing the former than the latter!


You're tunneling me because you're either being stupid as a Human or trying to push a mislynch as a Wolf.  Considering that Yugi is confirmed Human and I think Doodle is Human, it's clear which of the two I think now.

[Brawler4Ever]

Throughout the game, you've never indicated a hint of wanting to find Wolves, only pushing lynches.

What's the difference? And I have been trying to find wolves. I believed that I found a wolf in noc due to his shoddy logic. I believed that I found a wolf in you for supporting him in the eyes of the community. Then, it seemed to me that you were controlling everything from the background. So I have been trying to find wolves. I'm just trying to find the right way to find wolves.

Your suspicion of NoctuenOfShadow stemmed off of you being too timid to declare your suspicion; you made it clear when chatting to me that you only thought that he was a Wolf, which could have easily been taken for given.  I figured such timidity would be expected from a new Player that was a Human, but the other potential possibility was a Wolf too timid to draw the spotlight.  When I was brought up a chat conversation you had with Dudeman, your only interest was "what to pin Mashi with" rather than a thorough analysis of whether you believed I was Human or Wolf.

The only accusations that I've made this game were noc, Yugi, and you.  I knew Yugi's case to be weak. I discussed both of the other cases with other players to determine if the case was finding something that a wolf would do. What "wolfish" means to you is completely different than what "wolfish" means to me. I've been trying to find the correct reasoning to find a wolf. I'm sorry if that comes off as timid.
As far as the spotlight goes, I've literally been in it since the debate with noc. I've been a member of virtually every chat log, and I can be found in almost every thread page. So I am most definitely not trying to stay out of the spotlight.

When pressure developed on Olimar12345 and me Day 3, you placed a vote on Yugi and then only commented on believing Olimar12345 and me were Human, not bothering to push for a Yugi lynch, which would have been in line with your suspicions.

As I said several times, my accusation against Yugi was weak. Yugi made a mistake that almost everybody has made this game. My concern was that Yugi claimed humanship because of it. By the end of the Day, my vote against Yugi was inconsequential in the face of the debate between you and Olimar (1 for Yugi, 5 for you, 5 for Olimar). But at the time, I was fully aware that lynching Yugi based solely on that was not ideal. As I said then, in the face of other cases being only of inactivity, I would say that Yugi's case would be the strongest one available; even stronger than yours, if you can believe it. However, judging by the fact that a wolfing happened last night, I would say that backing off Yugi was the correct decision. But that's beside the point.

If you're a Wolf and both Olimar12345's wagon and my wagon were Human, it doesn't matter to you who dies.  In fact, a Wolf would rather keep me alive than Olimar12345 simply to push their suspicion on me, since more people were suspicious of me than of Olimar12345.  The fact that you decided to say you were starting to think I was Human that Phase only to do a 180 when convenient for you is in favor of suspicion against you, not evidence for your humanity.  In fact, if you were more suspicious of me than Olimar12345, the fact that you didn't vote for me is suspicious by most conventional TWG standards.

That's a fair argument, considering that I used the same argument against you regarding noc. I can't make any comment about conventional TWG standards, but I'm pretty sure that voting against you would have been a huge benefit to me if I was trying to earn the trust of the players. If I had joined against you, then I would have gained the trust of both Olimar and dudeman for following up on my initial (although weak) suspicion. I don't think anybody would have found that suspicious in the slightest. But I didn't, because I wasn't trying to not be suspicious. I saw two humans arguing. It was only after reading the thread over again did I feel a major concern about the matter.

If I were a Wolf, I would have wolfed Jub3r7 a while ago since I thought he was Vigi (on that note, the Vigi was probably BlackDragonSlayer, by the way).  Here's a (very) messy log between Jub3r7 and I on Facebook.

When did this log take place? Jub showed me the part where he would tell me that you thought that he was the vigi. That's what started our initial conversation. It didn't make sense to me, but I felt that Jub was telling the truth, for his part anyway. I don't see how you thinking Jub was the vigi gives you a Human lean. It's a mistake that a wolf could make, as well, from what I can tell.

If I were a Wolf, there would be no reason for me to have made the wolfing choices that have occurred in general.  Why would I have wolfed people who believed I was Human rather than people suspicious of me?  You can't even use the reverse psychology argument there because I would win more often doing the former than the latter!

All of those on Bubbles' watchlist were suspicious of you; namely me, davy, and dudeman. Wolfing Bubbles would give you credit as a human and give each of us more suspicion from the community, in the event that any of us came after you. So no, I don't believe that you would win more in keeping Bubbles alive.  Is it Farfetch'd? Yes. Is it possible? Also yes. [ <-- Pokemon pun. Get it? We're in a Pokemon TWG!]

You're tunneling me because you're either being stupid as a Human or trying to push a mislynch as a Wolf.

Can't argue with that. I didn't even know what a vigi was when I signed up. So yeah. Pretty sure "Stupid human" fits the bill. Either that, or I'm a crazy good actor. Or a stupid wolf. They could all potentially work.

Considering that Yugi is confirmed Human and I think Doodle is Human, it's clear which of the two I think now.

Why do you think that Dude is a human? The only reason that I've seen you give is that he's not interested in finding wolves. How is that a lean on him not being a wolf? I read through your list of Dude posts and every single one of them was A) I'm going to go for a safety, or B) I'm busy and can't contribute to the game.
The only case that I see going for him being human is that he hasn't been on since he last posted. However, his last post was an insta, and he might have pm'ed SP right after with the wolfing before he went awol for 3 days. I'm not saying it's likely, but I'm saying it's possible. And you're going to use my speculation against me, accusing me of trying to distract you from going after me. And I'm perfectly fine with that. I just wanted to throw my suspicion out there just in case I turn out to be right.

[Dude]

:/

[Brawler4Ever]

:/

[Dude]

OK both of you give me a tl;dr; version of your defenses and I'll decide from there.

[Brawler4Ever]

My case against Mashi:
A) "Alliance is unnecessary"
B) His accusation against Olimar made no sense
C) "Wolf Mastermind" (Jub's words)

If you're going to read any of the text walls that I linked above, I suggest B. If you want some heavy reading, then C is also good. But those are my 3 main points against Mashi. But if you don't want to read any of them, that works just as well.

[Dude]

Ok so

A. I don't think that matters...
B. Kinda agree but not much??
C. What.

Therefore, my vote is on Brawler4Ever

[Dude]

Actually wait, no vote

I was thinking I had to vote today not tomorrow.

I'll keep thinking about it...

[Mashi]

1. If I were a Wolf, Brawler4Ever would be dead so that I wouldn't have to deal with him this Phase.  Jub3r7 was completely content with lynching Yugi.
2. The only Players that thought I was Human were wolfed.  Why would I be killing off people who would let me coast when I even told you that I wasn't feeling into the game?  Brawler4Ever would at least have the incentive of leaving suspicious Players alive to try to lynch me.
3. Brawler4Ever has only pushed suspicions to get lynches, not to find Wolves.
4. I've Human read Brawler4Ever for a majority of the game; I wouldn't be doing a 180 on him unless I actually believed he was a Wolf.
5. I could totally beat Brawler4Ever in Brawl!!!!!!!!!

[Brawler4Ever]

5. I could totally beat Brawler4Ever in Brawl!!!!!!!!!

I didn't know that we were going below the belt, Mashi. Well, if that's how you want to play it...

Spoiler

Anime sucks.

[close]

[Dude]

Spoiler

Anime sucks.

[close]

Brawler4Ever

Now I don't give a damn.

[Brawler4Ever]

Don't care. Worth it.

[Yugi]

hey guys you probably need me so I'll just vote for brawler since I don't like his defence as much-

*sees that voting will cause an insta*

forever worthless

[Brawler4Ever]

YUGI'S BACK!!!

Are you going to count it Slow, even though my name isn't bolded? I'm fine if you count it, what with the technical difficulties and all.

Also, for the record: No. Anime does not suck. I only said that to get under Mashi's skin as a joke. Sorry Dude.