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[PC] Hollow Knight - "City of Tears" by PlayfulPiano

Started by Zeta, September 05, 2019, 02:48:49 PM

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Zeta

Submission Information:

Series: Other
Game: Hollow Knight
Console: PC
Title: City of Tears
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: PlayfulPiano

[attachment deleted by admin]

PlayfulPiano

#1
Reference: https://viewsync.net/watch?v=k-BswU3trrY&t=0&v=5jBrLedSJ-M&t=0&mode=solo

While there have been CoT arrangements made on musescore, there haven't been any that used the full theme for solo piano, only at the OST cutoff point. So I tried taking a stab at it, which I feel has gone pretty well.

The above link is what I used as a reference, since the official OST cuts out at 3 minutes (while the theme does go beyond to ~5 minutes in game). A person on YT was able to record the individual layers for the theme, which luckily overlaps most of the time throughout the piece. I did put preference for the inner loop though, which had the piano section.

I also went through on piano to make sure that all of the arrangement can be performed, as well as avoiding any chords beyond a 9th. There is one issue towards the end though (m129 - m140) which has some overlapping for both hands, so any suggestions to make that more playable would be greatly appreciated.

Beyond that, the piano/harp post-3 minutes tends to have an extra d at times, but it varies from audible to barely noticeable. I used my own discretion in when the d should be included, although that might need to be changed.

Lastly, there's probably some formatting issues with rests / dynamic markers that need to be adjusted, so let me know what formatting mistakes I missed.

Also feel free to ping me on the discord if you have any questions/concerns regarding the piece. -PlayfulPiano

Latios212

Hmm, I'm feeling a different rhythmic vibe than what's written. Much of what I'm hearing as well as much of what you wrote points more to 12/16 - that is, groups of three 16th notes, instead of groups of three pairs of 16th notes as 6/8 implies. That's not to say it's necessarily that all the way through, as there are some syncopated rhythms that don't fit well in 12/16, or even in 6/8.

Thoughts?
My arrangements and YouTube channel!

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turtle

PlayfulPiano

#3
Quote from: Latios212 on September 07, 2019, 09:32:29 AMHmm, I'm feeling a different rhythmic vibe than what's written. Much of what I'm hearing as well as much of what you wrote points more to 12/16 - that is, groups of three 16th notes, instead of groups of three pairs of 16th notes as 6/8 implies. That's not to say it's necessarily that all the way through, as there are some syncopated rhythms that don't fit well in 12/16, or even in 6/8.

Thoughts?
It's definitely weird (seems to be a reoccurring theme for pieces I pick lol). There can definitely be an argument for a 2 beat subdivision up to around m29ish at least with the arrangement, but the original with both loops combined has it seemingly a 3 beat subdivision up to measure 13 and then a 4 beat subdivision up to m45, in which it's both 3 beat and 4 beat overlapped on each other up to m76, then goes to a consistent 4 beat subdivision for the rest of the piece *I think*. Although when separated, their time signatures seem to also change (inner loop seems to be more similar to a 6/8 timesignature, which is why I initially arranged it to be 6/8).

12/16 would I guess be the safest time signature across the entire piece but it would probably have to receive constant subdivision changes though.

What are your thoughts on this? (12/16 constant throughout)
m1-4: 2 beat subdivision
m5-12: 3 beat subdivision
m13-m44: 4 beat subdivision
m45-m76: ? ? ? ?
m77+: 4 beat subdivision

PlayfulPiano

Updated the portal with hopefully better subdivisions.

InsigTurtle

Tbh, I'd still group the section at m.45 in groups of 3 on the top, with the quarters on in the lower staff. It's perfectly fine to have two different pulses in each hand in opposition to one another.

PlayfulPiano

Quote from: InsigTurtle on September 21, 2019, 09:33:28 PMTbh, I'd still group the section at m.45 in groups of 3 on the top, with the quarters on in the lower staff. It's perfectly fine to have two different pulses in each hand in opposition to one another.
Groups of 3 as in 3 sixteenths or as in the measure being divided into 3 sections?

InsigTurtle

As in groups of 3 16ths in the top staff, vs 4 16ths in the bottom staff as quarters

PlayfulPiano

Quote from: InsigTurtle on September 22, 2019, 11:53:18 PMAs in groups of 3 16ths in the top staff, vs 4 16ths in the bottom staff as quarters
Just tried doing it, turns out finale allegro doesn't allow split time signatures for different piano staffs.
So uh, can't do that on my end at least.

Besides that issue, any problems with the notation?

Static

- The entire piece should be 12/16 with 3-note subdivisions throughout; don't let the occasionally shifting rhythms confuse you.
- For the LH, please do not use 15mb. Just switch to bass clef (yes it's OK to switch for just one note; it's common practice in LH patterns with large leaps like this).
- At m45, keep the RH in groups of 3 16th notes like everywhere else. The new part is the quarters in the LH, which contrasts the same steady 12/16 feel as before (i.e. what Insig said). This is the only spot that should have quarter notes like this (groups of 4 16ths). This isn't a split time signature, this is just writing the rhythms differently (as if they were in a different time signature, but they're not).
- m79-116: Why are the notes beamed this way? It's inconsistent with all the other 12/16 patterns and is pretty confusing to read. You should separate the first 16th note and the 8th note in every spot where this pattern occurs.
- All key changes need double barlines.
- m129-140: Use dotted 8th rests instead of 8th+16th. It'll reduce a lot of clutter here.
- There's a lot of space at the bottom of each page, but the top staves on each page seem really close to the titles/page numbers. The notes on the top of page 2 even go beyond the page number. The spacing should be consistent on pages 2-8.

PlayfulPiano

Quote from: Static on December 06, 2019, 03:40:29 PM- The entire piece should be 12/16 with 3-note subdivisions throughout; don't let the occasionally shifting rhythms confuse you.
- For the LH, please do not use 15mb. Just switch to bass clef (yes it's OK to switch for just one note; it's common practice in LH patterns with large leaps like this).
- At m45, keep the RH in groups of 3 16th notes like everywhere else. The new part is the quarters in the LH, which contrasts the same steady 12/16 feel as before (i.e. what Insig said). This is the only spot that should have quarter notes like this (groups of 4 16ths). This isn't a split time signature, this is just writing the rhythms differently (as if they were in a different time signature, but they're not).
- m79-116: Why are the notes beamed this way? It's inconsistent with all the other 12/16 patterns and is pretty confusing to read. You should separate the first 16th note and the 8th note in every spot where this pattern occurs.
- All key changes need double barlines.
- m129-140: Use dotted 8th rests instead of 8th+16th. It'll reduce a lot of clutter here.
- There's a lot of space at the bottom of each page, but the top staves on each page seem really close to the titles/page numbers. The notes on the top of page 2 even go beyond the page number. The spacing should be consistent on pages 2-8.
-Alright, I fixed the subdivisions + used the global rebar music setting. Hopefully everything looks better now.
-I had to use 15mb as finale allegro does not support single note clef changes. That would have to be done after the arrangement is completely finished in terms of the submission process (in which someone else would have to make that change on their more up to date version of finale) to fix it. I changed this section to a flat base clef if that's easier to work with later.
-Done.
-Fixed.
-Changed.
-I might need help to fix this part, but hopefully what's done is better. There's less (but now consistent) space between the systems and they won't overlap with the page numbers. Page total is down to 6 (from 8 ).

Hopefully I didn't miss anything. Portal updated.

Static

Sorry for the wait on this one! It looks great! Just a couple more things:

- Some of the accidentals are touching barlines, you can fix this by adding space to the beginning of the measure (Edit Measure Attributes); if you're version of Finale can't do that I can take care of it.
- The F# in m125 should be a Gb
- The rests, particularly on page 6, should be lined up most of the time. Right now their placement seems kind of random.
- Some of the crescendos collide with stems; you can fix this by angling them. Again, if you can't make this change I can take care of it as well.

After these changes are made I'll add those clef changes in (any anything else you may need) and approve.

LeviR.star

The PDF looks a little funny, too. Drop your .mus file here once you're done so we can make a clean one for you.
Check out my Youtube channel for remixes and original music! LeviR.star's Remixes

Also check out my piano arrangements here on my PA thread! LeviR.star's Arrangements

PlayfulPiano

Quote from: Static on February 02, 2020, 03:17:42 PMSorry for the wait on this one! It looks great! Just a couple more things:

- Some of the accidentals are touching barlines, you can fix this by adding space to the beginning of the measure (Edit Measure Attributes); if you're version of Finale can't do that I can take care of it.
- The F# in m125 should be a Gb
- The rests, particularly on page 6, should be lined up most of the time. Right now their placement seems kind of random.
- Some of the crescendos collide with stems; you can fix this by angling them. Again, if you can't make this change I can take care of it as well.

After these changes are made I'll add those clef changes in (any anything else you may need) and approve.
-Not sure where the accidentals in question are. Should I just do a global select and EMA? (I'm able to do it on my end)
-Will fix.
-Hopefully this is fixed now. I tried using "rebar music" to fix it.
-Instead of using crescendos, could you apply mid-measure treble clef for the locations where there are high pitched left handed notes? I can't do that in finale allegro. e.g. m37-m41.

Static

The changes you made look good - I went ahead and got everything else for you, along with a few other changes:
- The tempo marking should be in a dotted quarter or dotted 8th value because of time signature - quarter notes aren't the main/default beat grouping in 12/16. (I went with dotted quarters)
- Adjusted some dynamic placements so nothing is touching anything else.
- Adjusted placement of 1st/2nd ending brackets since they were clashing with notes.
- I also changed m117-128 LH to bass clef; I think it works better for this section.
- Bn in m130 LH changed to Cb (chromatic enclosure to the Bb in m131).

If you're satisfied with the changes (see the file here), feel free to edit the sub with this file and I'll accept. If you have any questions about the above or concerns (like if anything I edited didn't carry over since I'm sending you a Finale 2012 file), let me know.