General Pokémon

[Nebbles]

I know c:

[blueflower999]

Nebbles you're such a cunt for running that set

Smogon is for banning Swagger D:

[Waddle Bro]

They already banned it.

They're also thinking about banning Gengarite from Ubers. Hella frivolous.

[Echo]

252+ Atk Metagross Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 234-276 (76.9 - 90.7%)

252+ Atk burned Metagross Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rotom-W: 117-138 (38.4 - 45.3%)

Even with a burn, it still 2HKO's Rotom-W (assuming the first attack was without a burn). Afterwards, you can get rid of the burn with Chansey's Heal Bell/Aromatherapy so Metagross isn't complete dead weight.

Waddle pretty much covered the main thing, in that physically defensive Rotom is by far the most common. So you need to face a non-defensive Rotom and get it on the switch, otherwise you're gonna get Burned and then Pain Split/Rest'd on and look like a fool.

True, but using a physical attacker against a physical wall generally isn't a good idea in the first place.

One of the key values of Trick is that it can let Pokemon stay in on and deal with other Pokemon that would otherwise be a problem. That's uh, kinda what your original argument was for using Iron Ball. If Metagross has to use up both an item slot and a move slot for a gimmick that doesn't even handle one of its main counters, then I honestly can't see how the strategy's worth it.

You could argue that Tricking Iron Ball could allow the rest of the team to handle Skarmory better, but TrickScarf is even more effective, by making Skarmory have a harder time with setup moves and the like.

252+ Atk Metagross Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Thundurus: 330-390 (110 - 130%)

I think you made a mistake in your calculations. Here:
Turn 1: 252+ Atk Metagross Trick vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Thundurus: 0-0 (0 - 0%)
Turn 2: 252+ Atk Metagross Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Thundurus: 330-390 (110 - 130%)
-- guaranteed 2HKO

You're not accounting for the turn that Trick is used here. You need to use Trick before Earthquake, so it's still a 2HKO like Ice Punch/Rock Slide.

Ice Punch/Rock Slide is better in more situations too, since it can KO on the switch if Stealth Rock/weather damage is taken into account, while Trick can't.

If you Trick Iron Ball to Excadrill on the switch, you don't take the heavy damage that Excadrill will do to you, and can OHKO it (and you get an Air Balloon :3). Heatran, as well, can potentially burn Metagross.

So it's only helpful against a couple of Pokemon, and only if they're switching in, and only if they have a specific item. This pretty much says that Iron Ball + Trick Metagross is only helpful in an ideal scenario. Strategies that can get you out of unfavourable situations are much more valuable.

If you're gonna predict the switch, then you might as well just pop the Balloon anyway. Against Heatran, you can pop the Balloon and outspeed it with some Speed investment for a KO. Against Excadrill, you could just have a Balloon to begin with and still have the advantage by popping the Balloon on the switch, and you can even switch in on Excadrill's Earthquake too. Not like Balloon Excadrill/Heatran's all that common anyway, I think they're mainly wearing Scarves nowadays.

Even so, it allows other Pokemon (that would otherwise be outsped) to handle the threat; this also includes Pokemon which aren't specifically a threat to Metagross, but to other teammates.

Eh... This is true, but it can also be flipped around. You could gimp the opponent with Iron Ball and then use a teammate to deal with it, but on the other hand you could just use a generally better Metagross set and then use a teammate that beats Metagross's threats even without the Iron Ball. You only get one shot for a TrickBall, so it's not as reliable as just using a good partner that can switch in multiple times regardless.

tl;dr, if you're gonna defend Trick + Iron Ball, don't try to nitpick my arguments, just make one or two really good points that shows that it has merit.

Cummon people, Iron Ball/Trick Klefki is where it's at.

Assault Vest Klefki is best Klefki

Like Waddle said before, if you're gonna do (Prankster) Trick shenanigans, just use a Choice item, or even a Lagging Tail. Klefki doesn't pack Earthquake or anything, so it can't really take advantage of the Iron Ball thing.

If you want to weigh down Flying/Levitate Pokemon, just use Gravity. And if you want to use Iron Ball, use it with Fling on something like Tyranitar so you can at least get a clean KO.

[FireArrow]

The point was more so that Klefki can viably pull it off unlike Metagross, being outclassed by every other trick item or not. I agree that's it's terribly gimmicky though trick assault vest sound hilarious.

EDIT: Lopunny could actually do that. .-.

[Waddle Bro]

I actually had a lot of fun recently fucking around in the higher portion of UU ladder with a Switcheroo Klutz AV Lopunny because UU is so stally. It was so fun when I managed to mess Blisseys and Suicunes up, but it's still a horrible set. Stallbreaker Mew is by far a better option.

[Nebbles]

Assault Vest is also fun on Florges or Goodra. Suck up special attacks like a champ.

[mikey]

Goodra

is that like seadra or what

[Waddle Bro]

Pro tip: You actually shouldn't use Assault Vest to make your Mon a special tank(with the exception of Goodra because of it's lack of support moves, although you should invest in HP and SpAtk instead of Special Defense). It's best used to boost your already existing bulk to allow you live hits without having to invest in your Special Defense.

If I could get a dollar for every Hydro Pump my Conkeldurr or Earth Power my Metagross has been able to live thanks to AV and retaliate back~

But AV Florges is as frivolous as AV Blissey imo. Wish+Aromatherapy is great support.

[Nebbles]

is that like seadra or what

you're joking right

[JDMEK5]

So I managed to land me a Piplup natured to Sp Atk, and a characteristic boosting Sp Atk at the expense of Atk. You'd better believe I maxed its EVs in Sp Atk. (Afterwards I split the of the EVs rest half and half between Def and Sp Def) Currently it's a Lv 100 Empoleon.

And right now I have its moves as follows:
-Ice Beam
-Hydro Pump
-Flash Cannon
-Toxic

I'm not sure what item to give it. Any suggestions as to what moveset/items I should be using to make the most of it? For reasons more extensive to list here, I basically need it to have Flash Cannon. So that's the only thing that has to stay the same.

[mikey]

Give it thunder wave

[JDMEK5]

Give it thunder wave

Reason? Right now I think with the super-Sp Atk it's more geared up for immediate OHKOs as opposed to just slowing the opponent down with paralysis. My original intent was to use a wide variety of moves so that it could get STAB on as many different types as possible.

[Waddle Bro]

Not a spread I'd run, but replace Toxic with either Grass Knot or Scald(in case you don't want to miss with Hydro Pump. And slap a Life Orb, Air Balloon or Assault Vest on it. I'd prefer the latter, but AVs are more harder to get.

[Echo]

Assault Vest is also fun on Florges or Goodra. Suck up special attacks like a champ.

I'm in love with Assault Vest Goodra in Doubles right now. Shrugs off Special Attacks, most physical Attacks just trigger Gooey, and Goodra opens up any defensive plays like Protect/Wide Guard with Feint.

I don't recommend AV Florges though, for reasons already mentioned.

is that like seadra or what

Think more like Barney, or a slimy Dragonite.

So I managed to land me a Piplup natured to Sp Atk, and a characteristic boosting Sp Atk at the expense of Atk. You'd better believe I maxed its EVs in Sp Atk. (Afterwards I split the of the EVs rest half and half between Def and Sp Def) Currently it's a Lv 100 Empoleon.

And right now I have its moves as follows:
-Ice Beam
-Hydro Pump
-Flash Cannon
-Toxic

I'm not sure what item to give it. Any suggestions as to what moveset/items I should be using to make the most of it? For reasons more extensive to list here, I basically need it to have Flash Cannon. So that's the only thing that has to stay the same.

Assuming Battle Spot Singles, give it an Air Balloon and either Scald or Grass Knot over Toxic. Air Balloon's useful so that it can come in on Ground-types like Garchomp. Toxic's not bad, I just prefer other utility moves like Scald/Aqua Jet/Yawn/Stealth Rock or coverage like Grass Knot over it. But if Empoleon's not from an earlier game with Move Tutors, or doesn't have certain Egg Moves, then your other options are limited.

If you're doing Doubles, consider a Trick Room team to make up for its low Speed.