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Author Topic: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy  (Read 328 times)

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Submission Information:

Series: Final Fantasy
Game: Final Fantasy II
Console: Nintendo Entertainment System
Title: Battle Theme 1
Instrumentation Solo Piano
Arranger: Yug Guy


Replacement Information:

Links to Existing Sheet: MUS | MIDI | PDF
Replacement Type: Challenge (new arranger)
« Last Edit: August 02, 2019, 07:23:45 PM by Libera »
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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2019, 03:07:28 AM »

Hey, uh...


Why are the only NES FF Battle themes on-site from the objective worst one of the three?

...also, name change to "Battle Theme 1" pls

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2019, 03:41:06 AM »

...also, name change to "Battle Theme 1" pls

Why, exactly? All of the other "Battle" replacements and existing sheets on the site suggest that this title is perfectly fine; some of them are yours, too. Is this new?
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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2019, 03:44:35 AM »

Why, exactly? All of the other "Battle" replacements and existing sheets on the site suggest that this title is perfectly fine; some of them are yours, too. Is this new?
That's what it's called on the official soundtrack. As to why FF2's naming convention is different from all the other games - your guess is as good as mine.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2019, 11:24:42 AM »

That's what it's called on the official soundtrack. As to why FF2's naming convention is different from all the other games - your guess is as good as mine.

That's really strange -- but, I can't argue with an official soundtrack.
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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2019, 10:06:06 PM »

This is pretty cool, hadn't heard this one before.

Firstly, notes look good apart from two places:
-Last note in bar 14 should be a Dn not an En.
-In the first set of four semiquavers in the last bar, the G# should be an Fn (it should be Bn -> Fn -> Dn -> Fn).

Other things:

-I said this on your last sheet where I admit it was kind of debatable whether articulations were necessary but here I think it's really vital that they be here.  The composer has put a lot of effort into getting different kinds of sounds out all over the place and the best way to get that across on the sheet is by articulations.  Slurring your grace notes would be a good place to start, but there are loads of others.  I get that you're seemingly not particularly fond of articulations, but I think it would be a really good idea to have a go at it here.  There's so much that could be done to bring this sheet to life.  If you need suggestions I can go more into detail, but I would recommend having a go yourself at seeing what you can come up with.
-You've tried very hard to get this onto a single sheet I can tell, but the result is that the whole thing looks very squished.  You've also had to go to a staff size of 0.54cm to achieve this which is frankly too small and you should really be aiming for above 0.6cm to keep it readable at the piano.  The only way I can see this comfortably sitting on one sheet is by using a lot of repeat sections, which is something I'm personally not too fond of.  If it were me doing this, I would definitely take this to two sheets and I'd recommend you do the same.
-Some accidental spellings:
The Ab in bars 3 and 7 I'd change to a G# (leading tone in harmonic minor).
The Ab, Gb, Fb and Eb in bars 17-18 I'd change to G#, F#, En and D#.  (Ab->G# for the same reason as before for consistency/harmonic reasons [the chords they make are nicer this way] also the Eb should be a D# because it resolves back to En.)
Similarly the Ab in bar 25 should be a G#.

-There are few places where I'm worried about playability.  Everywhere you have grace notes into an octave in the right hand I think it'd be better if you moved the graces up so that they're going into the top of the octave rather than the bottom.  Why?  Well because of the way the right hand is, when you're playing an octave all of your fingers are on one side and your thumb is alone on the other, so it's much easier to play notes directly before the octave with your fingers at the top rather than your thumb at the bottom.  In fact, it's very awkward to play these as written, especially up to tempo.  Another thing that worries me are the semiquaver runs in the lower layer in bars 11, 13 and 26.  As written they're very awkward I think, but perhaps with some careful omission of notes and shifting of octaves it could be made more pianistic while retaining the same feel.
-http -> https.
-I noticed that for the crazy thing in bar 1 you wrote in the reverb as a second layer, but in bar 14 you emulated it with pedal.  I personally prefer the idea of emulating it with pedal (as it's massively easier and less awkward) but I was just wondering why you chose to handle those two places differently.
-Some of the tremolo markings are a little short and could probably do with adjusting (I'm thinking about the ones between the C and Eb at the end of each of those sections.)

Thank you for replacing another of Commander6's atrocities.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #6 on: July 17, 2019, 12:54:28 AM »

...also, name change to "Battle Theme 1" pls
did that

-I said this on your last sheet where I admit it was kind of debatable whether articulations were necessary but here I think it's really vital that they be here.  The composer has put a lot of effort into getting different kinds of sounds out all over the place and the best way to get that across on the sheet is by articulations.  Slurring your grace notes would be a good place to start, but there are loads of others.  I get that you're seemingly not particularly fond of articulations, but I think it would be a really good idea to have a go at it here.  There's so much that could be done to bring this sheet to life.  If you need suggestions I can go more into detail, but I would recommend having a go yourself at seeing what you can come up with.
Agreed here. With the Tetris B theme there was a pretty uniform sound between notes but things seem considerably more decorated here.
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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2019, 01:33:57 AM »

-I said this on your last sheet where I admit it was kind of debatable whether articulations were necessary but here I think it's really vital that they be here.  The composer has put a lot of effort into getting different kinds of sounds out all over the place and the best way to get that across on the sheet is by articulations.  Slurring your grace notes would be a good place to start, but there are loads of others.  I get that you're seemingly not particularly fond of articulations, but I think it would be a really good idea to have a go at it here.  There's so much that could be done to bring this sheet to life.  If you need suggestions I can go more into detail, but I would recommend having a go yourself at seeing what you can come up with.
Alright, I've tried sprucing it up a bit. lmk if there's anything else I can do with it.

-You've tried very hard to get this onto a single sheet I can tell, but the result is that the whole thing looks very squished.  You've also had to go to a staff size of 0.54cm to achieve this which is frankly too small and you should really be aiming for above 0.6cm to keep it readable at the piano.  The only way I can see this comfortably sitting on one sheet is by using a lot of repeat sections, which is something I'm personally not too fond of.  If it were me doing this, I would definitely take this to two sheets and I'd recommend you do the same.
I usually try to get the page count down as much as possible. So, while I'd rather have it as one page, I'll go ahead and make it two this time.

The Ab in bars 3 and 7 I'd change to a G# (leading tone in harmonic minor).
The Ab, Gb, Fb and Eb in bars 17-18 I'd change to G#, F#, En and D#.  (Ab->G# for the same reason as before for consistency/harmonic reasons [the chords they make are nicer this way] also the Eb should be a D# because it resolves back to En.)
Similarly the Ab in bar 25 should be a G#.
Yeah, I had figured readability might be better than keeping the harmonic theory there. Fixed.

-There are few places where I'm worried about playability.  Everywhere you have grace notes into an octave in the right hand I think it'd be better if you moved the graces up so that they're going into the top of the octave rather than the bottom.  Why?  Well because of the way the right hand is, when you're playing an octave all of your fingers are on one side and your thumb is alone on the other, so it's much easier to play notes directly before the octave with your fingers at the top rather than your thumb at the bottom.  In fact, it's very awkward to play these as written, especially up to tempo.  Another thing that worries me are the semiquaver runs in the lower layer in bars 11, 13 and 26.  As written they're very awkward I think, but perhaps with some careful omission of notes and shifting of octaves it could be made more pianistic while retaining the same feel.
For the runs in 11 & 13, I've changed it ever so slightly to hopefully aid in performance. As for 26, I would appreciate suggestions.

-I noticed that for the crazy thing in bar 1 you wrote in the reverb as a second layer, but in bar 14 you emulated it with pedal.  I personally prefer the idea of emulating it with pedal (as it's massively easier and less awkward) but I was just wondering why you chose to handle those two places differently.
Alright, technical spiel incoming:

Reverb on the NES soundchip (among many others) was achieved by playing the melody in one of the square wave channels, and then having the second square wave channel play a slightly out-of-tune version of the melody played slightly out-of-phase, usually at a lower volume. This phasing was usually somewhere between an eighth note to a quarter note apart from the main melody. It's not something I can very easily explain without showing you samples from the song itself, but the run in measure 1 is not reverbed like m14 for two main reason:
  • The second line is not out-of-tune and is played more articulated (usually the echo is made to be more legato than staccato)
  • The second line continues after the first line has finished playing. Usually when songs use reverb, the second line will abruptly stop once the melody has completed (usually because the second line has another melody it starts playing immediately after and it needs to come in on the beat as opposed to slightly after it)

-Some of the tremolo markings are a little short and could probably do with adjusting (I'm thinking about the ones between the C and Eb at the end of each of those sections.)
I used the "Easy Tremolos" tool & would appreciate it if someone told me how to edit the tremolos using the tool.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2019, 08:18:23 PM »

I used the "Easy Tremolos" tool & would appreciate it if someone told me how to edit the tremolos using the tool.
If you go to the Window tab, you can enable the advanced tools palette so that it would be easier to access Special Tools (and the note mover tool if you'd like). Otherwise you can go to Tools > Advanced Tools > Special Tools > Beam Extension and click on the measure with the beam then change it appropriately. There are a lot of other neat features too like the beam angle, the accidental mover, note position, note shape, and other various tools

Regarding other parts of the sheet:
  • The guidelines changed so now the copyright, page number, and page titles should be right on the margin instead of with an offset
  • I think it would personally look better if you split the beams between the sixteenth triplet and the 4 32nd notes in m14
  • You can take advantage of the extra space by widening the distance between the insides of the staves, at least in the first page. I think it would look a little neater, especially with how some of the staccatos are close to each other (and also idk what the convention is regarding staccatos on two layers, but maybe putting 2 sets isn't necessary). Maybe you can even put 4 systems on the first page instead of 5
  • The simultaneous sixteenth notes + grace notes in m6 and m10 look awkward. It might be better to explicitly notate the grace notes as 32nd notes that start on beat 2.75, as idk how someone would play that otherwise. You could also just ditch the grace notes there and have them be regular sixteenths instead

As for 26, I would appreciate suggestions.
It sounds a little weird but you could do something like this? (and flip the other two quarter notes too)
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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2019, 09:22:31 PM »

If you go to the Window tab, you can enable the advanced tools palette so that it would be easier to access Special Tools (and the note mover tool if you'd like). Otherwise you can go to Tools > Advanced Tools > Special Tools > Beam Extension and click on the measure with the beam then change it appropriately. There are a lot of other neat features too like the beam angle, the accidental mover, note position, note shape, and other various tools
I didn't know how to do that before, so thank you!

The guidelines changed so now the copyright, page number, and page titles should be right on the margin instead of with an offset
Good catch.

You can take advantage of the extra space by widening the distance between the insides of the staves, at least in the first page. I think it would look a little neater, especially with how some of the staccatos are close to each other (and also idk what the convention is regarding staccatos on two layers, but maybe putting 2 sets isn't necessary). Maybe you can even put 4 systems on the first page instead of 5
I'll keep the number of staves the same for now - might change it later.

The simultaneous sixteenth notes + grace notes in m6 and m10 look awkward. It might be better to explicitly notate the grace notes as 32nd notes that start on beat 2.75, as idk how someone would play that otherwise. You could also just ditch the grace notes there and have them be regular sixteenths instead
I'll spring for 32 notes.

It sounds a little weird but you could do something like this? (and flip the other two quarter notes too)
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Not a huge fan of this particular layout. I'll keep it in mind, though.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2019, 10:25:42 PM »

Some more things:

-You missed the Eb -> D# in bar 18.
-Am I going crazy or did the left hand in bar 19-20, 23-24 used to be An -> Bb rather than An -> An?  It seemed right to me before, although it's kind of hard to hear with the An -> Bb motion going on up the octave.
-
It sounds a little weird but you could do something like this? (and flip the other two quarter notes too)
Not a huge fan of this particular layout. I'll keep it in mind, though.

Hmm, I actually think this a very good solution.  It sounds extremely similar to the original and is actually in the realms of something I imagine could be played.  Care to elaborate on your problems with it?

-Once we've gone to two pages I think the whole thing looks nicer with three bars per system.  It allows you to make more use of both pages by putting four systems on page 1 and five on page 2 which looks super clean to me.  That way the music has basically the same density throughout the entire sheet.  Even if for some reason you wanted 5-3 over 4-5 (not sure why you would though) it'd still look cleaner with three per system.  (It also gives those pesky tremolos a little more space.)

Alright, I've tried sprucing it up a bit. lmk if there's anything else I can do with it.

Some other things you could try:
-Slurring the low octaves up to the staccato note in the left hand in bars 3-4, 7-8.  It just makes it a little visually clearer, and I think it's warranted given the sound.
-Slurring grace notes into the following note.

-I'm not personally a big fan of the demisemis but it's up to you.  I think what I would do is anywhere you have two seperate 'graces' into a note I would drop the lower one: it's just too awkward to play.  This would actually only remove two from your sheet (bar 6 and bar 10) and then you could put the ones in bars 5 and 9 back in as graces since you don't need to make the rhythm clear anymore.

-The second to last semiquaver of bar 11 should be a G# rather than a G.  (That bit looks a lot nicer now by the way.)

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2019, 12:47:07 AM »

-Am I going crazy or did the left hand in bar 19-20, 23-24 used to be An -> Bb rather than An -> An?  It seemed right to me before, although it's kind of hard to hear with the An -> Bb motion going on up the octave.
It was in my original draft, but I took a close look at the song & it's definitely An/An & not An/Bb

Hmm, I actually think this a very good solution.  It sounds extremely similar to the original and is actually in the realms of something I imagine could be played.  Care to elaborate on your problems with it?
Honestly? I'm probably just not used to the way it sounds. Since multiple people have said that this is something I should do, then I shall do it.

-I'm not personally a big fan of the demisemis but it's up to you.  I think what I would do is anywhere you have two seperate 'graces' into a note I would drop the lower one: it's just too awkward to play.  This would actually only remove two from your sheet (bar 6 and bar 10) and then you could put the ones in bars 5 and 9 back in as graces since you don't need to make the rhythm clear anymore.
I'd personally like to keep them in - if you don't mind, of course.

-The second to last semiquaver of bar 11 should be a G# rather than a G.  (That bit looks a lot nicer now by the way.)
I took a close look at the song like I did above, and that is definitely not a G#.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2019, 01:10:49 AM »

It was in my original draft, but I took a close look at the song & it's definitely An/An & not An/Bb

I took a close look at the song like I did above, and that is definitely not a G#.

Yep, you're right.  My bad.

I'd personally like to keep them in - if you don't mind, of course.

If you want to keep them, then just make sure that the slurs end below the staccato dots like they usually do.  Also sometimes they're getting a little cramped up together so I'd suggest manually adjusting them a little so that they're crowded.  Also also, you're missing a slur in bar 9.

And the same thing with the slurs in the second layer in bars 17-18, 21-22; the slurs should end below the staccato dots rather than above them.

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2019, 01:40:40 AM »

u got it dude

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Re: [NES] Final Fantasy II - "Battle Theme 1" (Replacement) by Yug Guy
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2019, 02:04:47 AM »

Duuuuuude.
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